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Turkey: Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan Visits Egypt

Erdogan Egypt

By MAGGIE MICHAEL and LEE KEATH   09/13/11 05:08 PM ET  AP

CAIRO -- Turkey's prime minister presented his country as a model for an Arab world in turmoil, giving advice on everything from balancing secularism and Islam to challenging Israel during a high-profile visit to Egypt on Tuesday aimed at advancing his growing status as a regional leader.

Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan received a hero's welcome among Egyptians, impressed by his tough stance against Israel and searching for firm direction in a post-revolution period that has turned muddled and confused. His celebrity stood out in even greater contrast as the head of the Arab League admitted Tuesday that the pan-Arab body was "impotent" in the face of the Middle East's uprisings.

But the visit fueled a debate among Egyptians whether the Turkish model he touted – with an Islamic-based political party governing a secular democracy – was really applicable here.

Many are skeptical that Egypt's powerful Muslim Brotherhood, which often cites Erdogan's party as a model and is likely to gain significant power, can accept Turkish-style secularism.

A Brotherhood spokesman, Mahmoud Ghozlan, praised Erdogan as "a respectable leader who preserves the dignity of his country and who shares similar position with Israel." But he insisted Egyptians want an Islamic state.

"In Turkey, when a man finds a woman in bed with another man, he can't punish her by law because it is permitted there. It means that Turkey ... violates Islamic Shariah law," he told The Associated Press.

Erdogan has sought to leverage the Arab uprisings into greater influence for Turkey in a region where, as the seat of the Ottoman empire, it once ruled for centuries. He has grown critical of the regime in Syria, with which Turkey has close ties, for its bloody crackdown on protesters. The fall of Hosni Mubarak has opened the way for Turkey to get closer to Egypt, and Erdogan arrived with a host of officials to sign cooperation deals. On his tour, he will also visit Tunisia and Libya, where popular uprisings have ousted autocratic leaders.

Key to Erdogan's rising popularity has been his confrontation with Israel. Once an ally of the Jewish state, Erdogan suspended military ties with Israel and expelled top Israeli diplomats in protest over its refusal to apologize over deaths during a commando raid on a Turkish flotilla trying to break the blockade of the Gaza Strip last year. He said he had hoped to visit Gaza during his tour but "circumstances did not permit."

Brotherhood members rallied at the airport late Monday for the Turkish leader's arrival, cheering and hoisting a banner, reading "Egypt and Turkey together are one hand for the sake of the future. Erdogan is a hero." Big billboards lined up the airport road, showing Erdogan smiling with his hand on his heart.

Erdogan met Tuesday with Field Marshal Mohammed Hossein Tantawi, Egypt's military ruler, then addressed Arab foreign ministers at the Arab League. There he sought to embody a new regional policy for Israel to moderate its behavior.

"Israel must respect human rights and act as a normal country and then it will be liberated from its isolation," said Erdogan, interrupted several times by applause.

He backed recognition for a Palestinian state in a U.N. vote that the Palestinian leadership is pushing for this month, saying "this is not an option but a necessity."

In a later speech at Cairo's Opera House, he warned of increasing steps against Israel unless it compensates victims of the flotilla raid and lifts its remaining restrictions on Gaza. Israel "has lost a great chance, and ties have been lowered with Turkey, the region's biggest democracy."

Israeli Foreign Ministry spokesman Yigal Palmor refused to comment on Erdogan's comments. Israel has defended its raid on the flotilla, saying its troops were defending themselves against passengers who attacked them as they boarded. Last week, Israel expressed regret for the loss of lives and said it was time for the two countries to restore their former ties.

As part of Erdogan's media blitz, he was interviewed on Egypt's most popular political talk show, "10 o'clock," where he defended the concept of secularism – a term tainted as "anti-Islamic" in the eyes of many Egyptians.

"To Egyptians who view secularism as removing religion from the state, or as an infidel state, I say you are mistaken," Erdogan said. "It means respect to all religions. ... If this is implemented, the entire society will live in safety."

"Turkish secularism respects atheists because in the end Turkey is a state that believes in the rule of law," he said.

Since Mubarak's fall on Feb. 11, Egypt has seen its revolution turn chaotic on multiple fronts. Anger at Israel burst into a riot last weekend outside the Israeli Embassy during which protesters broke in and threw documents into the street. There are growing worries over the power of the Brotherhood, which stands to gain in upcoming elections, and growing criticism of the military's muddled handling of the transition.

Amr Shobaki, a columnist in the independent daily Al-Masry Al-Youm, wrote that while Egypt can't copy Turkey, it should be "inspired" by its experience. "Erdogan doesn't call secularists extremists in Turkey," he said. "He hasn't called on Turkish women to put on the veil."

On Israel, "Turkey had the guts to take a real decision despite its consequences, like expelling the ambassador, but it didn't storm an embassy and throw its papers in the air."

But Nabil Abdel-Fattah, at the Al-Ahram Center for Political and Strategic Studies, said Egypt's Brotherhood won't follow the example of Erdogan's Justice and Development Party, which has avoided pushing a religious agenda to focus on building the economy.

"The Muslim Brotherhood is trying is to put on an Erdogan mask ... to reassure liberal sectors in Egyptian society," he said. "The Muslim Brotherhood opposes secularism and hates to hear Erdogan talking" of one.

____

Associated Press writer Aya Batrawy in Cairo contributed to this report.

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CAIRO -- Turkey's prime minister presented his country as a model for an Arab world in turmoil, giving advice on everything from balancing secularism and Islam to challenging Israel during a high-prof...
CAIRO -- Turkey's prime minister presented his country as a model for an Arab world in turmoil, giving advice on everything from balancing secularism and Islam to challenging Israel during a high-prof...
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06:50 PM on 09/15/2011
Turkey;s Prime Minister Tayyip is a leader who stand apaer from so leaders in the Muslum World. He bring truth to that part of the world. The United States has brough false documents to misguide the Muslim Wotld. Democracy is not strong power in the US. The US. is confuss in the Muslim World. The United States is causing Muslim to fight among themselves with confussiom of the United States. The US. has cause more anger and hatred all through the world among Juduism, Christanity, Islam, Budahism and other religions. Prime Minister Tayyip should stay focus on the need of the Muslim Society (wqorld) and people. He bring peace and uphold morals of Islam.
06:25 PM on 09/15/2011
Nice. I hope the cheers were worth throwing Israel's long friendship and standing partnership under the bus. Go ahead Erdogan, enjoy your five minutes of fame amongst the Muslim world. Israel will be here to rebuild our ties with Turkey when you have left power.
kokobin
Against stupidity the gods contend in vain
07:08 PM on 09/15/2011
Nice. I hope the cheers were worth throwing Israel's long friendship and standing partnershi­p under the bus
*******************************
Turkey = Muslim democracy
vs
The Only Apartheid Regime in the Middle East.
09:41 PM on 09/15/2011
Nice. On one hand you label Turkey a MUSLIM country and on the other you label Israel apartheid for being a Jewish one. Your bias is showing...!
05:24 AM on 09/15/2011
It seems like HuffPo mods decided to censor my comment for no good reason.
Considering Turkish oppression of Arab states under the Ottoman Empire, Erdogan's intents are far from innocent. Nationalism is on a rapid ascent amongst Turkish youth, under the self-admitted banner of neo-Ottomanism. Turkey wishes to take the lead amongst Islamic nations, but only for its own benefit.
kokobin
Against stupidity the gods contend in vain
05:21 AM on 09/16/2011
Considerin­g Turkish oppression of Arab states under the Ottoman Empire, Erdogan's intents are far from innocent. Nationalis­m is on a rapid ascent amongst Turkish youth, under the self-admit­ted banner of neo-Ottoma­nism. Turkey wishes to take the lead amongst Islamic nations, but only for its own benefit.
**************************
I really do not care for the Turks, but all empires are as bad as the other. The British empire, the Spanish empire, the Portuguese and French empires all carried out mass slavery of the African continent in the Trans-Atlantic slave trade with an estimated 23 million Africans sold into slavery. The Arabs states carries out their own Trans Saharan slave trade. The Japanese embarked on colonial conquests that is still bitterly resented by China and Korea to this day. Need we discuss the atrocities of the Roman empire, or the Greeks under Alexander the not-so-Great in particular? The Hebrew nation states or the Pharaohs? Every nation and every empire acts in and for its own benefit.
04:15 AM on 09/15/2011
As much as Tayyip Erdogan likes to make himself look like a humanitarian Ghandi-esque figure, let us not forget that this man sat idly by when the rebellion sprang up in Libya and did not condemn Qaddafi because of the large amount of Turkish investments in Libya and did not condemn Syria till it had no choice because he started to look like a moron when it was obvious what types of atrocities Syrian government was committing near Turkey's South East border.
kokobin
Against stupidity the gods contend in vain
04:59 AM on 09/16/2011
And your point is...he is the only world leader who behaved similarly as you charged? Remember, the Hebrews did not want their dictator satrap Mubarak to be overthrown by the people, in spite of his various crimes against the people going back 30 years. With the USA, they feared the fruits of democracy the Arab Spring promised, and they will do everything to fix outcomes their way. The first to go was the illegal and immoral Gaza blockade at the Rafah border crossing.
01:01 AM on 09/15/2011
can wait for the political war to happen against , Israel against turkey , Egypt and Lebanon . zionest should be very worried.
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Sam Bark
It's a MAD world after all...
12:28 AM on 09/15/2011
I wonder when the little kid will yell -- The Emperor has NO CLOTHS.......LoL
kokobin
Against stupidity the gods contend in vain
04:24 AM on 09/15/2011
I wonder when the little kid will yell -- The Hebrews have NO MORE empires - just an apartheid regime.
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keezze
11:24 PM on 09/14/2011
This is funny like a devine comedy. The blind leading the blind. I wish both countries good luck and hope the region learns to get along.
12:41 AM on 09/15/2011
At least they are not stealing other people's lands.
01:24 AM on 09/15/2011
At least they are not looting the US treasury. Now come back and tell me Egypt gets the same amount of money blah blah ...
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Fred Ricardo
The white hat, Truth, Justices and theAmerican way
08:14 PM on 09/14/2011
I hope Turkey kicks some Israel butt.

America is to deep in the pocket of AIPAC to do the right thing for a Palestine State.

Some honest peace broker America has become. I am ashamed to be an America.
This comment has been removed due to violations of our [Guidelines]
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yonatan c
11:12 PM on 09/14/2011
then leave, anyone who is ashamed of the place they live doesn't deserve to live there.

as for Turkey "kicking Israel's butt" is this what you want? 100,000s dead? must be nice to be a war-monger while you sit on your armchair in a country you hate.
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Ali1812
04:09 PM on 09/15/2011
no if your ashamed you change it you must not be acquainted with constructive criticism have you ever heard of amendments
or
be the change you want to see in the world
07:53 PM on 09/14/2011
Many voices warned of Egypt's Muslim Brotherhoo­d after the so-called Facebook revolution­. Those voices were prescient. It isn't that "old guard" that makes up the current Muslim Brotherhoo­d. Most, perhaps half or more members, are under 30, and what may seem ironic to observers is tha many of those are advocating for a stricter applicatio­n of Islamic Law, or the Sharia. Whether Egypt goes that far is anyone's guess, since there are a number of secular groups who have significan­t influence. But the Brotherhoo­d is, according to tonight's PBS report, positionin­g itself for the future.

The Facebook/T­witter angle preoccupie­d much of the West's media, but what such technology made possible in this case was, at best, only a superficia­l ("of the moment") view of the revolution­. It certainly was not used at that time as a predictor of the future. It didn't give anyone a clear view to the greater inner factions whose struggle for power is ongoing. What evidence it might have provided for an ultimate outcome got little attention. Any negative or cautionary sentiment was dismissed.
06:06 PM on 09/14/2011
Turkey is no position to preach about democracy. Ask the Kurds.
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Farsha
07:08 PM on 09/14/2011
So is India ask Kashmirs and northeast territories.
So is Srilanka ask Tamils.
So is Thailand ask them why was taksin thrown out by elite.
So is USA with Two party system(yes one more than china) and what about occupations and unjust wars.
no one is in position to preach about democracy these days as democracy have been hijacked by rich elite and powerful
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Sam Bark
It's a MAD world after all...
12:26 AM on 09/15/2011
farsha -- Pleeeeeeeeeeeease.... the RICH elites and POWERFULS hijecked ALL COUNTRIES, NATIONS, TRIBES AND Religions..... No differnet then the powerful animals in the jungles and seas....
Nothing new, it's all the samE for the last million years.... what took you that long to recognize that......
06:02 PM on 09/14/2011
The ottomans are back.
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Farsha
07:11 PM on 09/14/2011
Turks, They never left.
Powerful nation who were opponents to greek empire.
Powerful under romans and muslim empires.
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Marcus047
inter arma enim silent leges
08:25 PM on 09/14/2011
umm, your historical information is wrong. The turks are from what is now the central anatolyan peninsula, not the west coast. during the time of the greek empire, the city states of western turkey were greek city states. the other great power of the time that opposed the greeks were the persians. the turks weren't really of any significance. they also weren't particularly during the roman era. Maybe your confusing them with someone else.
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Charlotte Bonnie
Agnostic. Free thinker. Debater. Independent. Gay.
05:37 AM on 09/15/2011
Romans?? :)))
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05:53 PM on 09/14/2011
So according to the Brotherhood what is most important for Egypt is a) Israel and b) to be able to punish a woman who cheats. Doesn't Egypt have bigger issues to deal with?

Mahmoud Ghozlan, praised Erdogan as "a respectable leader who preserves the dignity of his country and who shares similar position with Israel."

"In Turkey, when a man finds a woman in bed with another man, he can't punish her by law because it is permitted there. It means that Turkey ... violates Islamic Shariah law," he told The Associated Press.
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05:40 PM on 09/14/2011
Last thing Egypt needs now is a Turkish populist leader making speeches. The Egyptian spring is not anywhere near coming together into something better than what they had. The economy is a shambles. There is still nothing like an elected government. They are in danger of losing primacy in the region and falling into catastrophe as a failed state.

Israel is a distraction. It poses no real threat to Egypt, has no territorial ambitions and wants only peace and trade.

At the same time when I read I sense a " here we go again" attitude from Israeli public. Nobody can predict outcome. Israel was always outnumbered and outgunned. Always on the downside of opinion UN whatever.

If I had my armchair input I would recommend spending by Israel government with less emphasis on Iron Dome, fences and other defensive systems. They should raise up and fund another full time professional division on southern front. The navy needs more attention with more ships capable of countering any threats to coastal waters.
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05:13 PM on 09/14/2011
David Goldman explains why Egypt is going to need all the friends it can find--to buy food:

http://pajamasmedia.com/spengler/2011/09/13/endgame-for-egypt/
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Damn Damien
Naturally!
10:28 AM on 09/18/2011
After "food," the next few items on the list seem to read Israel and punishing women.
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madsen26
04:32 PM on 09/14/2011
How The Noose Is Tightening Around the Neck of The Apartheid Warmonger State

Even those states of the region are now JOINING IN with the tide that's moving faster and stronger every day against Israel. Yes, even countries that have despots with "peace treaties" with Israel..like Jordan. Just this week, King Abdullah II states:

"Jordan and the future of Palestine are stronger than Israel. It is the Israelis who are worried today," Abdullah told the audience late Sunday.."

and:

"King Abdullah said that during a recent visit to the United States, an Israeli intellectual told him that the Arab Spring serves Israeli interests. "I answered: 'On the contrary, you are today in a more difficult position than before,'" he recalled saying." (AP News wire - Sept. 12)

Everyone in the Middle East - right, left, center Islamic Secular Christian - is running to put a distance between themselves and Israel. She will hang alone and go down alone this time.
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HUFFPOST COMMUNITY MODERATOR
Json
Cynical dreamer, sarcastic idealist...
05:40 PM on 09/14/2011
Next time you wonder why peace has not come to the middle east, you can just look in the mirror and see the answer.
The gaps are wide, but they can be bridged by honest, thoughtful and diplomatic people. The kind of despicable rhetoric you spew only serves to inflame tensions.
I could refer to Palestine as a "Vicious thug terrorist regime" or any of a thousand clever little hate-filled names, but I call it Palestine, because someday (soon) I hope that Palestine will live in peace next to Israel.
You on the other hand...well here's a sample of how you refer to Israel
"The Apartheid Warmonger State"
"that filthy death camp state"
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madsen26
06:14 PM on 09/14/2011
Next time you open your hypocritical lying mouth, why not run back to Ashkenazimland and demand that they show honest, thoughtful and diplomatic" intentions? You know, those people Lieberman and Netanyahu whom you support in every single last position that they take? Yeah, those butchers, the ones who are the real and only cause of "tensions" due to their policies and choices. Your fellow Jews.

How I refer to Israel, is how it is.

You, on the other hand, are making me laugh laugh laugh when I think about how you called me "MUSLIM SCUM" under your other alter of EnderM, just too funny how you give yourself away when I'm not even Muslim but you assume everyone you hate has to be "Muslim".
06:29 PM on 09/14/2011
Wanna bet? Israel will be here for a very long time. The US will always support Israel so they will never be alone.
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madsen26
08:00 PM on 09/14/2011
Who cares where Israel will be - the fact is, that it's Palestine that will be here, and there will be a war. And Israelis will die and suffer in that war. The US won't be running to do much of anything for you when that all happens, times have changed, keep flattering yourself meanwhile and dream on.
01:56 PM on 09/15/2011
Times are changing and fortunately, the American administration is as well. AIPAC does not represent the views of most Jewish Americans and certainly not the majority of America. The US will foolishly veto the UN resolution and then the tide of American opinion is going to get very vocal as it's country becomes alienated and isolated.

What is critical, and essential to prevent a wave of anti-Semitism in the US is for Jewish Americans to become more vocal about its renunciation of Israeli expansionism as well as call upon AIPAC to rethink its position.

The Israeli administration with its saber rattling and expansionists policies is leading Israels people into another war. Americans are tired of war and will not support Israel's blind ambitions into another one.

Is it that the entire international community is wrong or just maybe......