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Rachelle Grimmer, Mother Who Killed Herself And Her Children In Texas Welfare Shooting, Had Long Struggled

Food Stamp Shooting

By PAUL J. WEBER   12/ 9/11 07:09 PM ET   AP

LAREDO, Texas -- In one of the poorest counties in the U.S., neighbors still pitied Rachelle Grimmer and her children. Grimmer would walk down the highway after midnight and beg closing crews at restaurants for food they planned to throw away.

Her children, 12-year-old Ramie and 10-year-old Timothy, didn't go to school. They bathed outside the family's trailer with the garden hose. Timothy wore the same camouflage shorts day after day.

Grimmer didn't have a job, and the state had denied the family food stamps and emergency help despite repeated requests. Tragic shootings sometimes come without warning, but interviews with family members and neighbors show there were many signs of frustration before Grimmer entered a state welfare building with a .38-caliber handgun earlier this week and shot herself and her children after a seven-hour standoff.

Ramie died Wednesday night at a San Antonio hospital; her brother was taken off life support Thursday and died. They led a miserable, nomadic life leading up to the standoff – which Ramie live-updated on Facebook with an eerie mix of detachment ("im bored") and dread ("may die 2day").

The children's father, Dale Grimmer, had tried three times since his divorce about six years ago to have them removed from his ex-wife's custody while they were living in Montana and Ohio, said his mother, Mary Lee Shepherd. She claimed her daughter-in-law had a history of mental illness that authorities ignored.

But Grimmer's friends disputed that, and the Montana Department of Public Health and Human Services had no calls about the family in its records, agency spokesman Jon Ebelt said. Ohio officials would not provide information about the family without an open records request, which can take weeks or even months to process.

Oscar Cuerrlar, a carpenter and neighbor in the Laredo trailer park where they moved in the spring, said he brought the family grilled fish and chicken after Grimmer's request for food stamps was denied; the only cooking surface in the RV was an electric skillet. He rejected the idea that Grimmer was mentally ill.

"Why is the mother-in-law saying that? That she suffered from mental problems? The woman spoke well with everyone," Cuerrlar said.

And yet, the family was clearly in dire straits even by the standards of Webb County, where the per capita income of $13,600 is among the lowest in the nation. By most accounts, Grimmer didn't come close to scrapping together near that much money.

At the Towne North Mobile Home and RV Park in Laredo, she paid $400 a month to dock her ragged RV, which has a wide crack in the outer wall filled by a scrunched child's bed sheet. The refrigerator was outside. Manager Janie Rodriguez's office was next to Grimmer's lot, and the two became close.

Grimmer didn't have a job, though Rodriguez said she sometimes made decorative pillows to sell. She suspected Grimmer paid her rent with child support checks. State records show the mother filed paperwork to open a business in April called "ShellRamieTim" but there's no indication of what she planned to sell.

Cuerrlar said she sold her red Ford truck to a scrapyard for $400 for food. When that ran out, she resorted to begging at restaurants.

Yet their ragged RV may have been a step up. A state child welfare worker checked on the family in July 2010 after receiving a report they were staying in tent on a Texas beach. Grimmer showed the investigator she had food and money and proved the children were being home-schooled. The Grimmers stayed in the tent and the case was closed.

Patrick Crimmins, spokesman for Texas Department of Family and Protective Services, said he could not speak in detail about the incident or why investigators didn't act on a family potentially living on a beach.

Poverty isn't always a reason for removing children from a home, said Katherine Kerr, spokeswoman for the nonprofit Texas Court Appointed Special Advocates.

"I'm guessing at the time it wasn't cold," Kerr said. "They had food. The mother was able to demonstrate she could get more food. The basics - food, clothing and shelter - can be covered in a way you and I might not feel comfortable with."

In July, Grimmer applied to join 3.7 million other Texans receiving food stamps. The state rejected her application month later because she never submitted proof of income, such as documentation of how much child support she received, said Stephanie Goodman, a spokeswoman for the Texas Department of Health and Human Services.

Grimmer also was denied emergency benefits because she reported that her child support was greater than her monthly expenses for rent and utilities, Goodman said. On Aug. 8, the state closed the family's file, and three months passed before caseworkers heard from her again.

Rodriguez said Grimmer vented often about being denied food stamps.

In mid-November, she asked the state to review her food stamp application again. It was rejected once more, but Grimmer never knew that. An agency supervisor couldn't reach her by phone.

What seems clear is that Grimmer became increasingly desperate. When Rodriguez led police inside the home early Tuesday, it looked as if the place had been ransacked. All the cabinets were flung open. The drawers had been pulled out and ransacked. A dirty pail of water in the kitchen caught Rodriguez's eye.

"Things were falling out of the doors. Blankets were thrown this way and that," Rodriguez said. "It's like she was looking for something she couldn't find."

On a table, in plain sight, was a box of bullets.

___

Associated Press Writers Chris Sherman in McAllen, Texas, Matt Volz in Helena, Mont, and Lisa Cornwell in Cincinnati, Ohio, contributed to this report.

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LAREDO, Texas -- In one of the poorest counties in the U.S., neighbors still pitied Rachelle Grimmer and her children. Grimmer would walk down the highway after midnight and beg closing crews at resta...
LAREDO, Texas -- In one of the poorest counties in the U.S., neighbors still pitied Rachelle Grimmer and her children. Grimmer would walk down the highway after midnight and beg closing crews at resta...
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01:30 PM on 12/25/2011
She could afford a gun, bullets and a smartphone (which her daughter used in order to post on Facebook during the ordeal)?
02:25 AM on 12/20/2011
I like this. Maybe, in the wake of this traged, those who are in a position of giving $5 or $10 or more dollars could so so in similar fashion.

... The young father stood in line at the Kmart layaway counter, wearing dirty clothes and worn-out boots. With him were three small children.

He asked to pay something on his bill because he knew he wouldn't be able to afford it all before Christmas. Then a mysterious woman stepped up to the counter.

"She told him, `No, I'm paying for it,"' recalled Edna Deppe, assistant manager at the store in Indianapolis. "He just stood there and looked at her and then looked at me and asked if it was a joke. I told him it wasn't, and that she was going to pay for him. And he just busted out in tears."

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/12/15/anonymous-donors-pay-off-kmart-layaway-accounts-across-country/#ixzz1h3cNYZWVhttp://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/12/15/anonymous-donors-pay-off-kmart-layaway-accounts-across-country/
02:49 AM on 12/20/2011
For Rachelle, Ramie, Timothy, their father, their grandmothers, their grandfathers, and everyone else like them. Merry Christmas: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Umb3KpGWReE
12:30 PM on 12/20/2011
While it is certainly a wonderful thing to help those less-fortunate if you're in a position to do so...no amount of toys at Christmas will put food on the table.

Perhaps the more appropriate action, in the wake of this tragedy, would be to donate generously to your local food banks/volunteer at soup kitchens/provide meals to families in need/provide assistance in completing paperwork-obtaining required documentation in order to obtain the necessary assistance, etc....and not just this time of year but throughout the year.
02:36 AM on 12/16/2011
Quote from the article above: Dale Grimmer, had tried three times since his divorce about six years ago to have them removed from his ex-wife's custody while they were living in Montana and Ohio, said his mother, Mary Lee Shepherd. She claimed her daughter-in-law had a history of mental illness that authorities ignored.

In another article I read, it was stated: "She really took a blow when her father was killed eight years ago. We don't think she ever really got over losing him."

According to these reports, Rachelle Grimmer's father was killed eight years ago. She was divorced six years ago. Her mother-in-law says she was mentally ill? I'm curious about that statement. What does she mean by "mentally ill"? Does she mean Rachelle was depressed or going through a complicated or extended grieving process?
10:48 PM on 12/15/2011
Apparently, Rachelle Grimmer is one of many in recent months:

‎... one in five Americans reported not having enough money to buy food in the past 12 months ...

... Between 2008 and 2011, the number of those living on food stamps, assistance to those who lack sufficient money to feed themselves and their families, soared by 50%, putting one American in seven in the programme. Catholic Charities recently revealed that requests for the working poor were up 80% over the second quarter, and up 59% for the middle class.

Similarly, Operation Homefront, a national organisation that feeds the families of military personnel, has seen demand for help double over the last two years. ... in Fort Hood, Texas, military families stayed up after midnight to register for a free turkey online for Thanksgiving. The 450 birds were gone within an hour...

... "The average [food stamp] recipient gets $134 a month in assistance, which works out to $4.40 a day. That's 10% less than the US Department of Agriculture's "thrifty" meal budget, and about half its "moderate" budget. For your average well-fed American, living on a daily ration of less than $5 for food prepared at home would be hard to imagine...

... a third of Americans are either in poverty or desperately close to it.

Full article: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/cifamerica/2011/dec/09/land-of-free-home-of-hungry
11:19 PM on 12/15/2011
Those who believe it's a piece of cake to get food stamps and nothing but her own irresponsibility stood between Rachelle Grimmer and potential relief may wish to make note of the following. After all, with 1 in 5 Americans having to rely on social support programs and the current state of the economy, their family may be next...

Difficult Paperwork
Many individuals and families that qualify for food stamps choose not to take advantage of them or else stop receiving them in part due to the difficult and demanding paperwork that is required to enroll and then to remain enrolled in the program. The average food stamp application is 12 pages long, with the application in some states being as much as 18 pages long. Ongoing paperwork must be completed in order to continue receiving food stamps.

Full Article: Problems with Food Stamps | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/about_5374987_problems-food-stamps.html#ixzz1gApqoTHQ
12:45 AM on 12/16/2011
It's interesting that you have professed the lack of knowledge leading others to speculate, yet that which is known you completely choose to ignore.

While the application process includes a number of pages...Rachelle Grimmer (nor the other 1 in 5 enrolled in the program), seemed to have great difficulty in completing and submitting the required application.

Out of curiousity, have you ever actually read over a SNAP application? Perhaps filled one out yourself? I have, and It's not all that difficult for the average person. In addition, while it may appear overwhelming...not all of the information is applicable to each applicant. By the time you're done, you may actually have had to fill out a total of maybe 3 or 4 pages of information.

Furthermore, her case was closed due to her failure to provide proof of income (ie., child support payments she received). If not her responsibility to provide the requested information...then who?

I find it interesting that we also grumble and moan over the extensive paperwork/verifications required to obtain a car loan, a mortgage, other credit, etc., yet we do it and smile gleefully when the new acquisition is ours. You would think when it comes to feeding your children, you could put aside your belly-aching over being inconvienced by having to provide personal information ...no matter how many pages you need to fill out. It's called priorities.
02:45 AM on 12/16/2011
From the article posted: A state child welfare worker checked on the family in July 2010 after receiving a report they were staying in tent on a Texas beach. Grimmer showed the investigator she had food and money and proved the children were being home-schooled. The Grimmers stayed in the tent and the case was closed.

I'd be curious to know if Rachelle Grimmer's tent was the only one on that beach...

According to the National Coalition for the Homeless, 61 percent of the country's local and state state homeless coalitions report a spike in homelessness. Total numbers aren't known because some homeless live with family, friends, in hotels, or shelters.

But a growing number choose to live in tent cities.

Thirty-five year old Karissa Vaugh in Seattle is a tent city resident.

"As soon as I lost my job, I kinda of lost my place to live and came here," Vaughn told CBN News. "This is something that, you know, it could happen to anybody. And the preconceived notions I had maybe before about homeless people are out the window."

Full article: http://www.cbn.com/CBNnews/492292.aspx
08:27 AM on 12/15/2011
I've seen some statistics that show over 50% of children that are murdered, are done in by the biological mother.

Had she spoke Spanish and the kids had dark skin, the State would have gave them Housing, Food, Clothing, Medical Care, Education, etc.......
Article said that State Workers KNEW the ragged RV was a step up. Think about it.....They KNEW>
02:45 AM on 12/15/2011
Rachelle's aunt paints a very loving portrait of Rachelle Grimmer and her children:

""She had a real respect for the environment and outdoors," Watts said. "She would always take the kids on nature walks and teach them about the different plants and animals. She was extremely creative and made candles and bookmarks that she sold. She was a really hard worker and was an electrician's apprentice when she was here. The woman wasn't afraid of hard work, that's for sure."

One love Grimmer instilled in her children was the love of reading, Watts said.

"I can't remember a time she wasn't here that she would be curled up on my couch, a blanket across her with all the kids sitting on her and around her, reading to them," Watts said. "They loved to have her read to them. I bet when the police walked in her little trailer in Laredo they were astonished at all the books they found."

Watts smiled as she remembered Ramie and Timothy as happy children, full of life and joy.

"Ramie had a smile that would light up an entire room and make all your worries go away," Watts said. "Timothy is all boy. He's sweet and never stopped smiling either, through good times or times that were really tough."

Full article: http://www.zanesvilletimesrecorder.com/article/20111209/NEWS01/112090301/2nd-child-shot-Texas-dies
02:25 PM on 12/15/2011
She also paints a very disturbing picture of Rachelle Grimmer.

I can understand not trusting strangers...however, her Aunt states she often refused help even from her own family for the very same reason.

I simply can't understand the focus she seemed to have with the government not helping her when she claimed to need it (as well as other reports which allege she believed the government was harassing her due to her ex's alleged affiliation with the Russian mob and the KKK), but turned down help from family who offered it.

Her apparent distrust of everyone around her sounds to be bordering on paranoia and I'm beginning to wonder if schizophrenia/bi-polar/anxiety disorder, etc., could have played a role here.
06:03 PM on 12/15/2011
sunnydayz: She also paints a very disturbing picture ...

She did? She noted that Rachelle had been hurt a number of times and had difficulty trusting people as a result. Those characteristics are true of hundreds of thousands of people.

sunnydayz: other reports which allege ...

I believe the key word there is "alleged". I've not seen anything that confirms she made those statements, neither have I seen anything that confirms or discredits the allegations. It may be true that her husband had some sort of relationship in place with the KKK or the Russian mob or maybe he didn't have any. Without some form of verification, it's all speculation.
06:04 PM on 12/15/2011
sunnydayz: Her apparent distrust of everyone around her sounds to be bordering on paranoia....

I don't feel her distrust is an indication she was mentally ill. She made her first request for food stamps on Jul 7. According to news reports, employees made arrangements to conduct a telephone consulation with her but if you can't afford to eat you usually can't afford a phone either. I don't understand why a case worker didn't sit down with her within hours of her request, conduct any necessary interviews and help her fill out the application form. (I have since read that some of these application forms run from 12 to 18 pages and many people have difficulty completing them.)

Five months passed between that initial request and the events that took place in early December. During that time, she sold her truck for food, she begged for food from restaurants and neighbors, and she made two additional requests for food stamps which were also unsuccessful. Paranoid behavior is rooted in untruths but the reality Rachelle Grimmer encountered was that she asked for help repeatedly and was not helped. Her response was not based in unfounded fantasy; it was her personal history.
11:55 AM on 12/14/2011
The most alarming thing to me in the whole story is that her NEIGHBORS saw her struggling to feed her kids and only ONE helped. I grew up in poverty and my mother shared what we had with other children when she saw them hungry. People are so willing to talk about people but charity begins where you see a need.
12:42 PM on 12/14/2011
Are you assuming that only one neighbor helped her out because only one neighbor who did so is mentioned in the article?
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Pleneras
07:44 AM on 12/14/2011
Poverty and hunger makes people insane when there are no other outlets. Sometimes it is hard to gather all the documents before the deadline to avoid rejection of application. Most of the time when calling the application worker you get a general phone number instead of the direct phone number and then they never ANSWER THE PHONE which then goes to the general voice mail box. Poverty and hunger can do damage to your soul and create a depression one cannot control. Welfare offices need to improve their contacts with the applicants. Why? Ever heard someone crying on the phone saying they've been calling for 3 weeks and can't get in touch with the worker and left messages that were never returned? Desperate people out there and they're not just black, hispanic and supposedly lazy... it's everyone who can't find a job and make ends meet with the high cost of living. PROTEST ON CONGRESS. JOIN OWS.
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mamahappy
not free, until we all are
09:59 AM on 12/13/2011
May they rest in peace, including the mother.
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mamahappy
not free, until we all are
09:58 AM on 12/13/2011
How sad.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
EdCorey1971
09:23 AM on 12/13/2011
According to this article: http://www.fathersandfamilies.org/?p=22157

The Father was denied custody 3 times.
12:56 PM on 12/13/2011
It is so sad that some of the people are to concerned about shifting blame. The real story is about a violent mother who killed her innocent children
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springtulip
04:20 PM on 12/13/2011
lmao....ummm. no. the article states exactly what all the other articles do. the ex mil claimed that. no records of that were ever found. nice try tho! lol
07:41 PM on 12/13/2011
springtulip I think you just have a problem with men. The fact is, it was the mother who acted alone and killed her children. Maybe you feel better to blame the father, however you are embarrising yourself my dear.
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Robbie12992
Bush didn't start the WMD paranoia.
12:36 AM on 12/18/2011
You have 4 kids and you're a single mom that has no way of even getting child support; although a lot of that is probably your fault, why are you spending so much time on Huffington Post? It really sickens me to think that my tax dollars are probably going towards feeding your children and you. I wonder why ya can't even keep a man. Maybe it's because you're so anti-male. At least that's what a big portion of your comments suggest. Get off here and go take care of your children.
12:40 AM on 12/13/2011
I have to disagree with some of the posts about the mother not being mentally ill. Anyone who would kill their children and themselves obviously has some mental issues. I grew up with a mother who was mentally ill. Somehow for most of my childhood she was able to behave in public. However, I had to sleep in the bath tub because it was the only room with a lock. She was constantly trying to kill me. It was not until I was 16 that she was unable to hide her illness anymore. Even then, no one, not even family came to my rescue. I am so saddened for these children. There is much blame to go around.
10:55 PM on 12/12/2011
Ohio officials would not provide information about the family without an open records request, which can take weeks or even months to process.

Seems like this part of the story pokes alot of holes in some of the comments here.
09:37 PM on 12/12/2011
I don't understand some of the comments being made. The father this, the exmother-inlaw that. What is a fact is the mother killed the children, shouldn't we be talking about how to stop the next mother from killing her children.
12:41 AM on 12/13/2011
I totally agree!
07:31 PM on 12/13/2011
I think most people here have an agenda, to blame every one but the mother who pulled the trigger. The father was spot on and I think some people are trying to discredit the father to shift blame
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springtulip
04:25 PM on 12/13/2011
well, part of the solution is discussion. if the mom did have mental issues prior, she shouldn't have gotten custody. if the father did have issues, how could this have been prevented? if it was the fault of the agency, let's figure out an easier way. no matter who's fault this ends up being, discussion of all angles is key to finding a solution.
07:29 PM on 12/13/2011
It seems to me the father was spot on. He complained about mental health issues and now two innocent children are dead because noone listen to this father. I still say we should be talking about how to stop mothers from killing innocent children
07:49 PM on 12/13/2011
My dear you are so disturbed. The mother killed her children. The discussion should be about this mother. Please seek help my friend, I will pray for you.
08:36 PM on 12/12/2011
Lets face it, the mother is the only one at fault in this case. WRAs can come up with all the excuses in the world, it doesnt change the fact that mommy dearest pulled the trigger.