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New Hampshire Debate: Mitt Romney Jobs Claim Questioned

By CALVIN WOODWARD 01/ 8/12 09:07 PM ET AP

Mitt Romney Jobs Bain New Hampshire Debate

WASHINGTON -- Executing a classic Washington dodge, Newt Gingrich told Americans that Medicare and Medicaid could be kept solid merely by ending fraud in the system, a promise of gain without pain that ignores the aging population and other great forces pressing on the programs.

Mitt Romney told voters he's done the math supporting his claim that he created more than 100,000 jobs in the private sector, but didn't share it. And Ron Paul came up with a shocking figure on Fed "bailouts" that bears little resemblance to reality.

A look at some of the claims in a pair of weekend Republican presidential debates and how they compare with the facts:

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GINGRICH: "The duty of the president is to find a way to manage the federal government so the primary pain is on changing the bureaucracy. On theft alone, we could save $100 billion a year in Medicaid and Medicare if the federal government were competent. That's a trillion dollars over 10 years. And the only people in pain would be crooks."

THE FACTS: Those who have crunched the numbers believe that squeezing every last penny of fraud from health care programs would not solve long-range problems that are at the heart of the federal government's budget woes and imperil Medicare and Medicaid.

Those problems are driven by an aging population, the cost of high-tech medicine and what some researchers see as a pattern of overtreatment – the widespread use of medical tests, procedures, drugs and devices that wind up being of little or no benefit to patients.

If policymakers once viewed health care fraud as akin to a cost of doing business, that hasn't been the case for years. President Barack Obama's health care overhaul law toughened penalties and gave law enforcement agencies new tools to combat fraud. That built on earlier efforts by the administrations of George W. Bush and Bill Clinton.

Health care fraud investigations are a major source of money recovered for taxpayers by the Justice Department, surpassing fines and penalties collected from defense contracting fraud.

Although cracking down on fraud and abuse will help to maintain Medicare and Medicaid, the administration and lawmakers are convinced it is not a magic elixir to restore the financial health of the programs. Knowing that has not stopped a succession of presidents and lawmakers of both parties from ducking tough choices and promising painless dividends by going after "waste, fraud and abuse" in government.

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PAUL: "I don't see how we can do well against Obama if we have any candidate that, you know, endorsed, you know, single-payer systems and TARP bailouts and don't challenge the Federal Reserve's $15 trillion of injection bailing out their friends."

THE FACTS: First, there are no fans of government-run, single-payer health insurance in the Republican field, despite Paul's suggestion otherwise Sunday. Newt Gingrich once endorsed the idea of requiring everyone to have health insurance, and Romney introduced a mandate for health coverage as Massachusetts governor. But that's a far cry from a Canadian-style health system that makes government the primary payer of people's medical bills.

TARP is the $700 billion Troubled Asset Relief Program that was proposed by President George W. Bush and passed by Congress in 2008 to help rescue imperiled financial institutions. Nearly all of the money has been paid back, with interest.

Paul's slam against the Fed ignores the fact that most of the $15 trillion he is talking about involved loans that were quickly repaid, sometimes the next day. And that's if these Fed transactions can even be considered loans in the conventional sense.

When the Fed lends money to banks, it creates the money out of thin air. When the banks pay it back, the money disappears from the system. If a bank borrows $5 billion from the Fed one day, then pays it back the next, and a week later borrows $5 billion more and quickly pays it back, the total would be listed as $10 billion, even though it's just the same money going back and forth and the treasury is in no sense being emptied.

That's how a federal report counted a running total of about $15 trillion in emergency Fed loans to domestic banks and their foreign subsidiaries between 2007 and 2010. The actual loan total, once paybacks are accounted for, is estimated at $1.1 trillion.

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ROMNEY: "In the business I had, we invested in over 100 different businesses and net-net, taking out the ones where we lost jobs and those that we added, those businesses have now added over 100,000 jobs.... I'm a good enough numbers guy to make sure I got both sides of that."

THE FACTS: Romney has never substantiated his frequent claim that he was a creator of more than 100,000 jobs while leading the Bain Capital private equity company. His campaign merely cites success stories without laying out the other side of the ledger – jobs lost at Bain-acquired or Bain-supported firms that closed, trimmed their workforce or shifted employment overseas.

Moreover, his campaign bases its claims on recent employment figures at three companies – Staples, Domino's and Sports Authority – even though Romney's involvement with them ceased years ago.

By that sort of charitable math, President Barack Obama could be credited with creating over 1 million jobs even though employment overall is down about 2 million since he came to office. But Romney accuses Obama of destroying jobs while using a different standard to judge his own performance – cherry-picked examples that leave everything else out.

By its nature, venture capitalism often results in lost jobs because profitability and efficiency are key to investors, not how many people are on the payroll. Bain Capital profited in cases where employment went both up and down.

Staples, now with close to 90,000 employees, and Sports Authority, with about 15,000, were startups supported by Romney. The direct workforce at Domino's has grown by nearly 8,000 since Romney's intervention. But Romney got out of the game in 1999, which has not stopped his campaign from crediting him with jobs created at those companies since then.

Romney toned down the braggadocio in the Saturday debate, saying that of the Bain-supported companies that grew, "we're only a small part of that, by the way." But he mentioned a few more successful companies, again without giving voters a breakdown of his "net-net" calculations.

No one has been able to produce a full accounting of job gains and losses from the scores of companies Romney dealt with at Bain. But a Los Angeles Times review of Bain's 10 largest investments under Romney found that four of the big companies declared bankruptcy within a few years, costing thousands of jobs and often pension and severance benefits.

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GINGRICH: "Under Obama, 2011 was the highest price of gasoline in history. It is a direct result of his policies, which kill jobs, raise the price of heating oil and gasoline, weaken the United States, increase our dependence on foreign countries and weaken our national security in the face of Iran trying to close the Straits of Hormuz."

FACT CHECK: It's true that the average price of gas last year was a record: $3.52 per gallon. Tying that completely to Obama is a stretch because some of the reasons for expensive fuel have nothing to do with him or the United States.

Oil and gas prices jumped early last year due to the political uprisings in the Middle East and North Africa. The revolt in Libya, for example, cut off about 1.5 million barrels of daily oil exports. While that's only a small part of what the world uses, global demand was rising at the same time as fast-growing economies in the developing world, such as China and India, needed more oil.

The Republican candidates almost uniformly blame Obama for hindering U.S. energy development, taking their cue from his moratorium on oil drilling in the Gulf of Mexico after the Deepwater Horizon disaster, a ban now lifted. Oil and gas companies have been ramping up extraction of oil and gas from shale rock deposits in states such as North Dakota and Texas.

All told, there is now a boom in oil drilling and extraction of natural gas in the U.S. Active U.S. oil rigs increased 22.5 percent in 2011, and the oil and gas extraction industry added 25,000 jobs, up 12 percent.

___

ROMNEY: "I cut programs, a whole series of programs. By the way, the number one to cut is Obamacare. That saves $95 billion a year."

THE FACTS: That math looks like it doesn't add up. The nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office estimated that House Republicans' legislation to repeal Obama's health care law would have actually increased federal deficits by $210 billion from 2012 to 2021.

Romney's statistic approximates how much the government expects to be spending annually once the law's provisions are fully rolling. But it appears to ignore the law's revenue-generating provisions, such as a tax on the most generous insurance plans and fees imposed on parts of the health care industry.

___

Associated Press writers Ricardo Alonso-Zaldivar, Tom Raum, Christopher S. Rugaber, Nancy Benac, Charles Babington and Jim Drinkard contributed to this report.

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WASHINGTON -- Executing a classic Washington dodge, Newt Gingrich told Americans that Medicare and Medicaid could be kept solid merely by ending fraud in the system, a promise of gain without pain tha...
WASHINGTON -- Executing a classic Washington dodge, Newt Gingrich told Americans that Medicare and Medicaid could be kept solid merely by ending fraud in the system, a promise of gain without pain tha...
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
tubette
01:02 AM on 01/09/2012
One thing seems pretty clear about Mitt. He will say anything for a vote.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
pmoschetta
Where are the Jobs, Speaker Boehner?
02:02 AM on 01/09/2012
As will all of them, and of course if these debates had real moderators who were non partisan, they'd be calling these frauds on their lies and embellishments
11:17 PM on 01/09/2012
That's the problem. They will say whatever it takes to get our vote and we forget their promises are not binding. It's more like reality TV than anything else.
12:53 AM on 01/09/2012
Mitt is used to being in charge. He isn't the smartest, he isn't the most creative, he isn't a problem solver, he isn't a visionary, heck he isn't even a caretaker. He is the guy with the most money and everybody works for him! Nobody challenges him even when he is wrong. Instead people say stuff like:

"Precisely Mitt. Before we move on, do you have the time to consider a few additional issues?"

The above line is code for your wrong, you don't know what you're talking about, do you wish to change your mind or just have us do what ever it takes to make this go your way??

That's why Mitt gets so bent out of shape when challenged in the debates or when one of the candidates or the moderators interrupt him. Even his mother was not permitted to interrupt him once he was able to talk. It's also why he's so comfortable taking multiple positions. There's no shame in his game, only set backs, and unless he joined a fraternity in college, he has not felt shame in DECADES. All of the authority none of the responsibility. Absolute power corrupts absolutely!
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HUFFPOST BLOGGER
Ed and Deb Shapiro
12:17 AM on 01/09/2012
Willard Mitt Romney is hard to pin down-
He isn't what he puts forward as who he is!
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Bert Dodson
libral gramma
12:11 AM on 01/09/2012
facts you expect the GOP to use facts....oh my gawd where have you been the GOP is faith based, didn't you get the memo. You me we all have to close our eyes and wish real hard for the free markets invisible hand to lead us to the shining city on the hill. Riches will tinkle down on "middle income" (classless) we will be free of the burden of social security, medicare, minimum wage, collective bargining and our children will skipp down streets paved by goldline
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Vapula
Failure is not an option
09:53 PM on 01/08/2012
The argument about jobs is really stupid. Government, which ever party is in power, does not create jobs except to the extent that it increases government jobs. Jobs are created by supply an demand. If there is a demand for goods and services and a lack of personnel to supply that demand jobs will be created it really is that simple. But saying that reducing taxes on the rich creates jobs is a monumental con trick. There is no correlation between lowering taxes and job creation. This is just a Republican lie to pander to the 1%. If an entrepreneur can make an extra million by increasing his labor force he will do it regardless of the tax rate. Globalization has caused more job loses than taxation, but as that is a Republican pet to line the pockets of the 1% it is hardly ever criticized. Slashing government spending - which will increase unemployment and increasing tax on the 99% which will also increase unemployment by lowering demand for goods and services is a recipe for disaster. And the Republicans will be glad to lead America to disaster.
10:51 PM on 01/08/2012
So capitalism exists? But it doesn't? You need to clarify your comments.
09:40 PM on 01/08/2012
3.52 was not a record. It topped 4 bucks just before the big meltdown in Bush's administration. Or my memory is bad. I paid over 4 bucks
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
gws1968
Then they came for me and there was no one lef....
02:04 AM on 01/09/2012
$3.52 was the National average for the year. It takes highs and low's to create an average.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
pmoschetta
Where are the Jobs, Speaker Boehner?
02:05 AM on 01/09/2012
Gingrich, who in similar fashion with these other clowns, will bank on their minions to have short term memories and claim life has always been difficult under Obama while accomplishing that without mentioning the runner up to Reagan on spending
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09:30 PM on 01/08/2012
Flipper Mittens is so endearing.
08:50 PM on 01/08/2012
Of all the Republicans on stage...I find Mitt the most galling.
The others might be moonshots, hacks and philanderers but at least they believe what they spout.
10:52 PM on 01/08/2012
Yes it is a shame people believe in truth shout them down. Hide the truth.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
msfaye
08:38 PM on 01/08/2012
there was a movie called pretty woman and the lead male character played by richard gere would buy up companies, chop them up and sell off the pieces leaving unemployed people everywhere. the female actress julia roberts asked the male actor so you don't build anything the male actor says no you don't do anything the male actor says no. the companies were worth more broken up and sold than to buy as a whole. it seems that mitt romney is living the pretty woman world. he wants to be president of the USA to have the ability to do it all over the world and first and foremost in the USA. he would come out of it a trillionaire. vote for him if you want but remember people like him want you to be a serf he cares nothing for you and probably laughs at all the people at occupy wall street. remember leona helmsly only the little people pay taxes. they also lose their jobs, houses, cars, families, lives while people like mitt romney have and get only the best and never lose anything.
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Heartlight3
Every act is an act of self-definition.
10:20 PM on 01/08/2012
I think we need to think long and hard about electing someone with Romney's company destroying record in charge of our country. Remember, we elected someone who had bankrupted every company he had owned to run our country and then acted surprised when he bankrupted America too.
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madisonlike60
opinion will not belie the truth
12:38 AM on 01/09/2012
Hear, hear.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
msfaye
01:46 AM on 01/09/2012
agreed one hundred percent. the idea is to privitized companies and then break them up and sell off the pieces. it is already apparent companies have no problem with shutting down companies and sending them to other countries. when the best job you can get is a service industry job and need several to make ends meet that is a sad state. not everyone can be a computer whiz, a doctor, a nurse. some people need simple factory jobs and that is all they can handle.
10:54 PM on 01/08/2012
Yeah quoting movies... the sign of true education. LOL!
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SeeTheFnords
Look out - there's one behind you!
01:51 AM on 01/09/2012
If the role fits, why not?
08:32 PM on 01/08/2012
So are they stupid or are they liars? Or both?
10:54 PM on 01/08/2012
No just not lying like you like is all.
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dee50
Vouchercare-No Way!
11:39 PM on 01/08/2012
GOP Site Plans To Infiltrate Liberal Sites With “Trollsâ€
http://newsone.com/nation/casey-gane-mccalla/gop-site-plans-to-infiltrate-progressive-with-trolls/
08:04 PM on 01/08/2012
Private equity guys don't create jobs. Quite the contrary. They buy companies, load them up with debt, fire employees to save money and then sell the company. This is what Mitt did for 20 years at Bain Capital.
10:55 PM on 01/08/2012
Or they go bankrupt? Employees still lose jobs and ... Same as you stated. But everyone looses.
12:43 PM on 01/09/2012
The bottomline is that PE firms, by and large, provide no benefit to the overall economy. They are an arbitrage opportunity for a handful of wealthy investors.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
ksmith111
micro blog
08:01 PM on 01/08/2012
If you are fortunate enough to have a job with a retirement plan elect Mitt the Sh... watch it disappear.
10:56 PM on 01/08/2012
He would have to do a lot to match the hit I took under Obama.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
oftenlucid
Look Up "Liberal". Looks pretty good, huh?
12:27 AM on 01/09/2012
Garry,

I am interested why you say that. What specifically did Obama's polices do that impacted your retirement?
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
tubette
12:57 AM on 01/09/2012
Geez Garry, you may want to change your portfolio..... mine is finally recovering from the crash before he was elected.
07:46 PM on 01/08/2012
Listening to Romney, you'd think he'd...

...wrestled with an alligator, tussled with a whale; handcuffed lightning, and thrown thunder in jail...

...no Mitt...

...seriously, that would be Ali...
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
mozartmaid2
opera singing fighter for truth
08:19 PM on 01/08/2012
...or Putin, lol.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
kevamy
07:31 PM on 01/08/2012
Mitt Romney is nothing more than a liar and a fraud. He has not created jobs, he has fired people, raided their pension plans and ran with the money. the only jobs he has ever created are his own.
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07:33 PM on 01/08/2012
FF yet I am surprised HP's Calvin Wood had a go pass to write this article. We all are aware how leaning to the right this blog has become since the take over.
10:51 PM on 01/08/2012
Yes! A Real Gordon Gecko.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
cbates
07:28 PM on 01/08/2012
Now that the facts are out we can expect that the next debate moderators will use the facts to correct the outlandish claims made by the candidates. If we can not get that level of performance from the oderators what is the value of me sitting listening to a bunch of lies.
08:42 PM on 01/08/2012
It seems Stephanopolous tried early in the debate last night, but Romney talked in circles for an extended period of time. With just two debaters prior to the general election, it might be a little harder for Mitt to duck the issue.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
tubette
12:58 AM on 01/09/2012
Which is why they won't let many people do the moderating.