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The Relationship Between Christianity and Capitalism

Posted: 04/20/2012 4:53 pm

Just as, 50 years ago, liberalism was the vital center of our politics, our religious landscape then was dominated by mainline Protestants and a Catholic Church becoming less Roman and more American every year. One of the most symbolic events occurred in 1958 when President Dwight D. Eisenhower laid the cornerstone for the new headquarters of the National Council of Churches here in New York City. Before a crowd of 30,000, Eisenhower quoted George Washington, who described religion as the firm foundation of the country's moral life.

That was the decade America put God on our paper money and in the Pledge of Allegiance. And though the churchly DNA often fostered racism, anti-Semitism, bigotry and Cold War dogmatism, many thought biblical religion, in its various incarnations, was the engine driving the American future.

But then, says Ross Douthat, American Christianity went off the rails -- and now threatens to take American society with it. Furthermore, the snake in the garden is not atheism, nor is secular humanism the worm in the apple. Our fall, he argues, is the work of heresy, as you see in the title of his latest book: Bad Religion: How We Became a Nation of Heretics.

Below is a clip from my conversation with Douthat that airs this weekend on Moyers & Company. Look for it on public television.

 
 
 

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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Cole 33
Careful. We don't want to learn from this.
02:06 PM on 04/23/2012
Dude, it's christianity, you can make it work with anything, if you're not constrained by rationality, then you can make your religion fit with anything you like, no one can tell you your wrong, because it's all just interpretation.

In reality, there's no such thing as "religion" or "religious belief", it's only ego, and follow other peoples egos.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Cole 33
Careful. We don't want to learn from this.
01:55 PM on 04/23/2012
"That was the decade America put God on our paper money and in the Pledge of Allegiance. And though the churchly DNA often fostered racism, anti-Semitism, bigotry and Cold War dogmatism, many thought biblical religion, in its various incarnations, was the engine driving the American future."

"But then, says Ross Douthat, American Christianity went off the rails "

Then? No it went off the rails long before that, God on our money and Pledge is the illustration that it already had gone off the rails.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Carrie-On
Most you receive is the least deserved.
11:50 AM on 04/23/2012
Washington what ("George Washington, who described religion as the firm foundation of the country's moral life.")? He certainly was out of touch, even then! Religion needs to be in homes, private lives, as in Japan where people are tolerant of others beliefs preferences, and habits. In the USA it has become a social group that seemingly permits gathering at any and all costs (but for income!). Homo sapiens seem to desperately need a father, daddy, protector, answers, proof, assurances’, and guarantees and the Lemming Syndrome is alive and well.

Once the "churches" and it's leaders begin to walk their own talk, there may be a difference but like their desperate needs for income/members when the permitted any music, dance, attire to bring 'em in, compromising standards has not been the answer.

On that note, how dare any bishops, pope, or clergy at all criticize and even dream of controlling women (and nuns) when they have not yet learned how to control themselves. I could have laughed myself silly at that 'news' if I didn't have a sore lip from pondering this great interview. Masterful, indeed!
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wayoutleft
my nano-bio coded in a period: .
11:28 AM on 04/23/2012
As we know, Jesus teachings are surrounded in mystery: Why didn't poor people creep Jesus out? Where is the lost text about the poor acknowledging individual responsibility that precedes The Beatitudes? Why didn't Jesus bundle contributions to pro-government conservatives? Why isn't Jesus more like Tim Tebow and less like some subversive who got executed? Why didn't Jesus ever "profile" in bling and bubble-top cars like the Pope? Why didn't Jesus pass out rubbers?
The lost capitalist Jesus is being rediscovered. See Wilhelm W. Wilhelm, "Die Verlorenen Investitionen von Jesus" ("The Lost Investments of Jesus"); vol. vi-viii; Leiden, 1972.
11:14 AM on 04/23/2012
GOP Jesus
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aMPCviZC8J8
10:54 AM on 04/23/2012
This is a fascinating question and there is such an obvious difference between the United States and other western nations who also have a background in christianity. In most western nations christianity is a force for peace, justice and the common good but in America the devolution of christianity has inspired hatred, greed, assaults on women's rights and blind support for every stupid war we start. Realizing that culture shapes religion we must ask ouselves why is our culture so much more vicious and violent than these other places?
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Carrie-On
Most you receive is the least deserved.
11:51 AM on 04/23/2012
Aw, yes - again, any group that is predominately male abuses "the least of those."
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Carl Crooks
The last moderate conservative in America...
10:14 AM on 04/23/2012
"That was the decade America put God on our paper money and in the Pledge of Allegiance. And though the churchly DNA often fostered racism, anti-Semitism, bigotry and Cold War dogmatism, many thought biblical religion, in its various incarnations, was the engine driving the American future."

Those people still exist today,they're called the tea party....religion has done enough damage to society,let's let science and rational thought have a crack at running this country for once....
PROGRESSISGOOD
Without Economic Justice, There Is No Justice!
10:09 AM on 04/23/2012
Someone once made a claim about the role of religion in economics. Something about Opiate for the masses and Riches for the elites.
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Erdgeist
per omnia extrema
03:34 PM on 04/22/2012
One typical wrong assumption Americans make, including fundamentalist Christians - including even Bill Moyers - is the US was founded upon the principles of capitalism. But history tells us otherwise, the US was NOT founded on capitalism. You have to study Alexander Hamilton to know what I mean. In a nutshell, the original economic system of the US was a modification of mercantilism. It boils down to protect American industries; use tariffs, and with the revenue generated by tariffs pay for the workings of the federal government (which eliminates an income tax). The 'American economic system' worked until Reagan signed the first FTAs (Free Trade Agreements). Now we are in decline because we have not been true to our own economic principles laid out by Alexander Hamilton which had nothing to do with capitalism.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Blackorpheus
the decisive blows are always struck left-handed
02:27 PM on 04/22/2012
It is an old and sordid story. American Puritanism has always justified personal wealth as signifying "good works." It is 2012 and that twisted symbiosis of God and $$$ is revoltingly in place.
jhNY
Mercy.
02:04 PM on 04/22/2012
With all the money they've got, you'd think the Christian rich would put more effort into breeding tiny camels and constructing the world's biggest needle.
08:52 PM on 04/22/2012
very, f****** funny --- May I use this ?
jhNY
Mercy.
11:13 AM on 04/23/2012
Happy to think you might want to. Of course!
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G8RH8R
Remember Blair Mountain
09:24 PM on 04/22/2012
F&F!
jhNY
Mercy.
11:14 AM on 04/23/2012
Thanks!
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
myth1958
reasonable, except when I'm not
12:19 PM on 04/22/2012
Moyers does his usual superb job tackling a thorny issue. He and Douthat postulate about money and God, religion and politics: if not a dance with the devil, then at least a wave across the floor. Of course religion is just big business in a different building, so it ain't hard for them to sympathize, and commiserate over the details running empires take. Eisenhower and every president since has danced on the edge of church issues, aware of the awesome power preachers have to turn a group against somebody in disfavor. Rather, we should have more room between the two camps for public safety. The bad examples all around the world of religious wars killing millions - even between sects of the same faith - should inoculate Americans from lusting for more theocracy in government. One year your faith is up; another year, your faith is down: you and your people are driven from your communities so ours can take over. With a secular government, however, religious groups are like snarling cats under the table, pushing for advantage and fighting over scraps. The real business gets done aboveboard - on the table - by equals. That concept is out-of-reach for the religious folks.
HopeWFaith
We the People
08:09 AM on 04/23/2012
There's a reason why so many Americans can "see the light", and do understand the value in separating church from state. Too bad so much ignorance is running rampant in our nation now. De-funding education, de-funding all structural national policies will never keep democracy alive. It will destroy it, peg by peg.

Those who claim to be "real Americans" under the guise of the GOP are blowing the darkest smoke I've ever seen, and those drunk with self-riteousness are breathing it in like addicts. While there are still a lot of us who can see into the lies and dissect them, there are far too many who've bought the story, hook, line, and sinker. These are the very people who will allow, unless some great change takes place soon, the very dissolution of our democracy. These folks seem determined to self-destruct, just so they can go out thinking, "I was right.".

There is little left of democratic, logical governing in the US, as it is. Still, implementing sound fiscal responsibility, long term health can be achieved. But it has to be supported by structured nets of logic and determination, held together by arms of justice, clean energy, balanced with good healthcare. The threads of the American nets are fraying and narrowing daily.
09:28 AM on 04/22/2012
This just proves you can be both interesting and wrong. If you understand the historic Jesus, you'd know why he and his message are irrelevant to a realistic worldview. You cannot shoehorn your mythology into reality.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
frank day
Obama cares about all of U.S.
11:40 AM on 04/22/2012
That was quite the cryptic comment.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Molly D
04:53 AM on 04/23/2012
It's amazing too, that this is virtually never admitted! Followers of Jesus can NOT use his teachings to organize a state. At best, you can have groups of families existing in a state organized and defended by other people. Like the Amish.
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HeevenSteven
20 Minutes into the future.
08:38 AM on 04/22/2012
Dou that thing you do Ross: Torture logic and history to justify whatever your money changers want.
PROGRESSISGOOD
Without Economic Justice, There Is No Justice!
10:12 AM on 04/23/2012
Which party is more Christ Like?

The party that wants to tax the rich to feed, house and educate the poor; or, the party that wants to eliminate food, housing and education for the poor in order to give more tax cuts to the rich?
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Freethinking American
Reason begets humanity for humanity
07:29 AM on 04/22/2012
Theism has had its day and failed miserably due to its reliance on superstition and ignorance, now let's try reason and humanism!
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
frank day
Obama cares about all of U.S.
11:41 AM on 04/22/2012
Hear! Hear!