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09:33 AM on 04/26/2011
"... only nationalism and patriotism, often combined with religion, are more a deadly tribalism than religion."

http://scienceblogs.com/effectmeasure/2009/06/freethinker_sunday_sermonette_158.php#more
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Jelle NL
Unity in Diversity
07:28 AM on 04/26/2011
“The chief cause [of the unrest among nations] is the misrepresentation of religion by the religious leaders and teachers. They teach their followers to believe that their own form of religion is the only one pleasing to God ... when with very little effort their differences and disputes could be overcome ...” - Abdu’l-Baha
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11:33 AM on 04/27/2011
one religion advocates killing and one sells ideas. another religion tries to improve the individual. From my viewpoint it seems right or wrong; the outcome may seem horrible or beautiful. I suppose fast food franchises could all agree to sell the very same food. No more fast food competition just by all selling the same food. Why don't they do it? I believe it must be the same reason for the diversity in burger menus that maintains different religous teaching. It would be a great effort to overcome the differences in religous teaching to overcome disputes. Religion teaches us about how we would like things to be; everlasting perfect life ect. As Kermit the Frog said." it aint easy being green the colour of a leaf"
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LintLass
"When you can balance a tackhammer on your head...
02:18 PM on 04/27/2011
I think sometimes a lot of 'desert religions' don't have enough shades of green. They're structured for people who live in absolutes and scarcities and rivalries, and can't cope with *lots of life* in some key ways.

I think subconsciously this is what leads them to see diversity and even the green Earth as 'enemy,' not *home.*

:)
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Jelle NL
Unity in Diversity
03:41 PM on 04/27/2011
Yes, those who see themselves as the restaurant owners (clergy) might stir up competition. That is one reason why we should reduce their role; and start cooking ourselves.
03:08 AM on 04/26/2011
Interesting. Here's some background on another book (fiction) that examines religious beliefs, but from another angle:

http://kck.st/eznkA2

It discusses questions about the Bible from two sides (for and against) in a world where Jesus and the Apostles must fight a horde of mindless zombies.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
cayuse
Soaring Eagle, soaring to Spirit from the ego self
11:23 AM on 04/27/2011
I would only say you can ask one does he prefer Pespi or Coke.

You can then ask those who prefere Pepsi (for or against, even why)...

Not much different than Mammon or the Spirit of GOD.

What is most funny is the Car Salesman approch to calling Spirit names. Almost as bad as Believing the the Name of Spirit ONLY.

A spirit has no body or mind. No sex, sexual relationships, etc. Ghost is probably a little better than Zombie in fact. Since Living Spirit is not dead, if feels JOY and BLISS not by body actions chasing desires, wants, senses, emotions and EGO. Like my waste is sweeter smelling than yours.

There is a difference in Pepsi and Coke. I prefer Coke. For what is was in the past and what it is today. I could care less what you flavor is and for that matter how my choice creates such a nerosis in you.

D-Need -Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs
This is Maslow’s understanding of neurosis. Perhaps you went through a war as a kid. Now you have everything your heart needs -- yet you still find yourself obsessing over having enough money and keeping the pantry well-stocked. Or perhaps your parents divorced when you were young. Now you have a wonderful spouse -- yet you get insanely jealous or worry constantly that they are going to leave you because you are not “good enough” for them. You get the picture.
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02:06 PM on 04/28/2011
Could'nt all of ones nuerotic obsessing be calmed with a simple security blanket of some kind? Or even an actual teddy-bear or stuffed monkey.
11:26 PM on 04/25/2011
So interesting -- a welcome read with much to ponder and feel positive about.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
cayuse
Soaring Eagle, soaring to Spirit from the ego self
11:26 AM on 04/27/2011
Especially if you are a land developer or Lumberman in Brazil
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Henry Plantagenet
11:03 PM on 04/25/2011
I think it would be fair to say that religion, rather than being the root of these conflicts, is the excuse for conflict, the fig leaf behind which politicians justify their intent to murder the folks over in the next valley.
08:36 PM on 04/25/2011
I love the video!
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Angie Tyne 1
Please reply so I can be a Pundit!
07:29 PM on 04/25/2011
Religion is the ultimate expression of tribalism. It literally takes it to another level. Your god will not only reward you in this life but for eternity! Wow, what a deal!

- Not only is your tribe better than the one up the river but GOD says so, too.
- Depending on the deity, you are authorized to wipe out that tribe from up the river and claim their lands in the name of your particular god.
- Your god then rewards your tribe and you personally with blessings in this life and forever after death.
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almostlyniceguy
Not young enough to know everything..
05:34 AM on 04/26/2011
You hit the nail on the head. Thank you for your post.
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HUFFPOST COMMUNITY MODERATOR
Angie Tyne 1
Please reply so I can be a Pundit!
03:35 PM on 04/26/2011
:D

Fanned...back!
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squat6971
59 *was* divine -- 60? 61? not so much
09:24 AM on 04/26/2011
Word.
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FoxReincarnated
Red Ninja Warrior
06:33 PM on 04/25/2011
Stalin was Russian Orthodox, Hitler was a devout Catholic, I even found a picture of Hitler leaving a church. What stinks? Oh right, the defending of bad religion, namely Christianity. MLK is the only decent Christian.

Tribalism is about family connection, spiritual growth through a community of people. Tribalism could also be a euphamism for Paganism. Be careful whose toes you step on, they could be your own. Especially since Christianity has ties in many religions: paganism, buddhism, mithraism, zorostrianism, and judaism.
07:46 PM on 04/25/2011
The point is that tribalism insinuates itself into all human organizations. And religions are human organizations. When tribal identification becomes paramount and malevolent, then there is a problem.
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recless
Evidence first. Believe later. Maybe.
10:35 PM on 04/25/2011
Where do you get your info from? Stalin was an atheist who did not practice the religion he was raised in. Hitler was no practicing Catholic either. Granted I hate religion as much as any Gnu Atheist, but let's keep with the facts please.
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FoxReincarnated
Red Ninja Warrior
07:32 AM on 04/26/2011
http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/False%20Religions/Roman%20Catholicism/hitler_at_catholic_church.jpg

There are books about Stalin being a Russian orthodox christian.
12:43 AM on 04/27/2011
Stalin was no atheist. He promoted state atheism as a means to power. After the czars the Orthodox Church as THE powerbase in the Russian state. In order to undermine their authority, the Communists declared the Church anenthema.

And read Mein Kampf for Hitler's views regarding religion. He was certainly no atheist either.
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FoxReincarnated
Red Ninja Warrior
06:26 PM on 04/25/2011
Replace the word tribalism with Christianity. Sounds like someone defending something no longer worth defending to me.
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LintLass
"When you can balance a tackhammer on your head...
06:06 PM on 04/25/2011
'Tribe' at least means 'We're concerned with what's good for our tribe,' which usually means good relations with the neighbors, rather than 'trying to conquer them or die to convince them and ourselves about some point.'
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05:34 PM on 04/26/2011
I think your thinking clearly in a way that benefits all of us. Examine what a thing really is and then make judgment as to it's power on the universe. Thankyou for helping me to calm down and think clearly.
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LintLass
"When you can balance a tackhammer on your head...
09:44 PM on 04/26/2011
Well, blessed be. Maybe you can return the favor sometime. :)

Lady knows there's times it could be helpful. :)
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LintLass
"When you can balance a tackhammer on your head...
10:14 PM on 04/26/2011
Ooh, a thought you might like, (You got your first fan, btw, I read some more of your posts. :) )

..If you consider, too, that with different tribes, there is also the possibility of *affection and sharing between them.* (Rather than just trying to impose some 'one correct orthodoxy' on all, which invariably, of course, divides people *against* each other: trying to 'conform' all divides all, while trying to *divide* all tends to end up making the divided more *conformist.*)

What we can do is balance, share, be unafraid to differ, *and,* with all hope, be friends. We can be all these things.
11:16 PM on 04/26/2011
Sporting events bring about tribal behavior amongst the fans of the competing teams. In the UK they have "football hooligans" and in the US we have cars being burned during the NBA playoffs. Not exactly "neighborly" behavior. Gangs are also a manifestation of tribalism. Sure they look out for each other within the confines of their group, but are hostile to outsiders.

That is why focusing on creating positive myths and memes is needed to counteract some of these behavioral tendencies that live in our DNA.
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LintLass
"When you can balance a tackhammer on your head...
12:19 AM on 04/27/2011
Does saying, 'You people over there are tribalists, tribalism is Ultimate Bad,' help, there?

Sports hooliganism has a great deal to do, I think, with the fact that sports are too often a dumping ground for a lot of things society denies about our human nature and needs... But it *lacks* (especially in modern manifestations) a lot of the myths and ways that have to do with *honor,* and being more than surrogates *for* things like civic pride and the attachments thereof. (Especially in the corporate controlled, detached, big-money mass-marketed forms of today.) People are living all set against each other, while at the same time being expected to *conform* and judge the 'other' as 'bad,' and the bad behavior associated with sports comes *out* of that, as much as anything else. If you've ever watched one of these sports-related riots *start,* it's not necessarily about the sports... sometimes it's the *winners* venting on their own *town.*

It's inarticulate, and it's not *really* 'tribal' in that sense. Other things, things denied rather than ennobled, are hung on it.

But it's also why people lament that sports heroes aren't often what the myths of *sports* say they ought to be.

I do think we should look to that.

As for just saying 'Gangs are tribal, tribal is bad,' ...I have to point out that some city tribes are ..tribes, not *criminal* 'gangs.'
05:59 PM on 04/25/2011
There is hope that as a global civilization we could learn so gently via myth, meme, and meditation to overcome the hardwired tribal instincts. Cum Ba Ja. Keep preaching peace and sibling-hood. It cannot hurt -- I'm sure it can't. :)
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Uncle Bob
Darwin loves you.
04:23 PM on 04/25/2011
A bit amusing. Tribalism is bad, but humans are super super special.
06:35 PM on 04/25/2011
Humans have the ability to exercise free will and over ride primitive impulses.
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Uncle Bob
Darwin loves you.
07:32 PM on 04/25/2011
Free will is just a vague word for agency. All living creatures have varying degrees of it.

Societies promote training children, just like training any animal can drastically change their response to various situations. Once again, humans are very good at it, but the overall trait is far from unique.

I think you missed the irony I was pointing at.
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Ytrus
''it's a map''
04:15 PM on 04/25/2011
Second paragraph and you're already going off on a ridiculous tangent. It showed so much promise too, but you spoiled it.
thebigbike
ran away to be a cowboy
04:07 PM on 04/25/2011
religion has certainly served as a mighty effective "shroud" for tribalism sometimes indistiguishable, sometimes uniting tribes or even more often creating new tribal differences (sunni versus shi'a , anyone? never mind the proliferatn of comepting chritian sects)
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LintLass
"When you can balance a tackhammer on your head...
06:08 PM on 04/25/2011
The thing about tribal warfare is, ....it stops. Wars over religious absolutism... Don't.
04:01 PM on 04/25/2011
Myths, memes and meditation... great linking of these important themes. Meditation can be so impactful on an individual basis, but think about what it could mean on a global basis! And I love the video... "I'm a learn-it-all" Great concept!