Don't Let Cheney Pick the Battlefield

My posts sometimes go on a bit.

Tonight will be different. My point is simple: We cannot let Dick Cheney set the terms of America's debate about torture.

The former vice president is calling on President Obama to release more secret documents. Cheney claims Obama is hiding proof that waterboarding and other disgraceful interrogation techniques were "enormously valuable in terms of saving lives and preventing another mass-casualty attack on the U.S."

Now, there are any number of ways of responding to this claim. The editorial board of the New York Times went with this response:

"Mr. Cheney claims that the waterboarding saved thousands of lives. Most accounts that don't come from officials involved in the formation of those policies suggest that that is not the case. The question needs to be answered so Americans can decide if they want to buy into Mr. Cheney's view that the ends always justify such barbaric means."

Wrong. Totally wrong.

This is not a question that "needs to be answered." Cheney had eight years in power to press this question if it is so damn important. But it is not important. It's a question as relevant to American democracy as appointing a blue-ribbon commission to study what advantages and efficiencies we might achieve by repudiating the Declaration of Independence and rejoining the British Empire.

Here. Just watch a man talk some sense. The man is Shepard Smith of Fox News. Seriously. As Andrew Sullivan put it, Smith "sums up in remarkable clarity what I sometimes use too many words to say." (Now, be forewarned. You are about to hear a very passionate, patriotic Shep Smith accidentally say a word that starts with an "F" and ends with an "UCKING." But trust me when I say it's for a good cause.)

Got that? "I don't give a rat's ass if it helps. We are America! We do not f**king torture!"

Shep Smith, ladies and gentlemen. Of the dreaded Fox News.

This does not need to be a partisan issue. In fact, any Republican who's out there backing Cheney on this should pause long enough to read Wednesday's Andrew Sullivan post called "What Cheney Did To Conservatism."

None of us -- not conservatives, not anybody - should let Cheney distract us right now. There's no way for both Cheney and America to win here. So Cheney needs to lose.

Do not let him frame the debate. Do not let him pick the battlefield.

Huffington Post blogger David Quigg's previous posts about torture, civil liberties, and the "War on Terror" are archived here. His Twitter feed is here.

Comments

[Brian Ross - Huffpost Blogger]

You miss the larger, and far scarier question of WHY he is throwing himself under the media bus, and daring the Obama Administration to go after him. The Neo Conservatives are not gone, and Cheney is working in their interests. My point is too long to make here, but I did in my HuffPo article. Dick Cheney: Through the Cracked Moral Compass, Darkly at p://www.huffingtonpost.com/brian-ross/dick-cheney-through-the-c_b_189959.html

[offred]

It's becoming more and more clear that Cheney was running the White House. I'd love to see the results of any mental competence tests he may have taken during the required physical exams he took during his years in office. I think it's obvious he's delusional.

I also hope Bush's National Guard records are finally released.

[citizensrus]

Great article. I wish I could make it go viral.

[Zen0469]

Put Cheney on the first bus out of town.

Perhaps the old proverb "Out of sight, out of mind" will come true.

[busterbrownthefirst]

You said it! Isn't it amazing that in the past two weeks we've heard more from him than we did in the eight years he was officially appointed Prince of Darkness? Cheney saying that torture saved thousands of lives is like him saying that not rebuilding New Orleans prevented another Katrina. There's this little cause-and-effect thing where he's always had a lot of problems.

[dragonlady620]

We can set the terms for Cheney-20 to life sounds about right.

[incognito-ergo-sum]

Let Cheney keep speaking, his tongue has turned into a shovel. Wait on the Grand Jury till more of these folks spout off on tv.

[OverIt]

Thanks David. I agree with you and Shep 100% on this. What we may or may not have learned through torture can never justify the fact that our values were betrayed and laws willfully broken.

Debating whether torture actually produces some true or useful information is as pointless as debating whether Nazi-era experimentation on Jewish twins --- often leading to death --- produced useful data about genetics and disease in general. Of course they did on some level! BUT that says nothing about whether the experiments should have been conducted.

"Results" were not an excuse then, and shouldn't be now. Unless we are ready to posthumously exonerate Hitler, our government must conclude that the ends don't justify the means.

Whether we should torture or not is wholly independent of whether it leads to useful intel. It is wrong on its face. We are America, and we SHOULD NOT torture. Period.

[AmazingChicken]

David, thanks for the ref to http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2009/04/what-cheney-did-to-conservatism.html It's an article everyone should read.

[HeevenSteven]

Cheney knew this inquiry was coming; so why didn't he get those documents declassified himself? Because they don't exist, but no problemo--he can just keep asserting that they do.

[Saidas]

Every time I hear these people say that waterboarding isn't torture, I wonder why someone doesn't counter with, "If that is so, then why don't you do just one session for us to prove it."

[CantStopUsNow]

Someone actually did just that.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/04/22/hannity-offers-to-be-wate_n_190354.html

[SamSeven]

When will justice be served? Next week, next month, 10 years from now.....

The Justice Department is sabotaged by Bush. Gates is still in the Department of Defence, McKusky (sp) is sitll head of the FBI/NSA or whatever. Left overs from the Bush administration and they have not be replaced or put in jail.

Does anyone in America have the guts for truth and justice? Obama is a eloquent speaker but can he put money where is mouth is.

[MPeter]

Yep. Thanks Mr. Quigg. There is no other way around it. No torture. Dick should shut up and wait until he is asked to face the charges. He committed crimes.

[Rmtns]

Bravo For Shepard Smith AND you Mr. Quigg!

[createpeace]

So right.

I wonder if there would have been a way for GWB to pardon all of them before he left office?

I looked to me as if Cheney's hold over Bush waned just a bit at the end, Cheney was powerful but not powerful enough.