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Deepak Chopra

Deepak Chopra

Posted: August 18, 2010 06:38 PM

Who's Inside the Muslim Box?

What's Your Reaction:

When people argue over religion, they tend to forget a simple question: Is it better to be happy or to be right? In societies that practice religious tolerance, the answer falls to the side of happiness. Being right on matters of God is left up in the air. That's a good practical reason to remind people that, of course, anyone who wants to build a mosque has the right to do so, even if questions of zoning, local acceptability, and so on also enter the picture. In the case of Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf, a moderate cleric who has openly divorced himself from political issues, he can tolerantly be seen as a force for good -- he describes himself as a bridge builder between cultures.

Anyone who tries to make hay out of this issue wants to battle over who is right and who is wrong. Politicians fan public controversy for their own gain, and it's dubious if they contribute to anyone's happiness. President Obama deserves credit for making a sane, measured, adult statement about the proposed Islamic center -- that has always been his style. His later clarification, in which he said that he wasn't endorsing the center or agreeing with the wisdom of building it, gave Republicans a wedge for some flip-flop rhetoric. The kerfuffle is just that. Hamas also saw something to gain by wooing Obama, very clumsily, in their endorsement of the project, but it's an obvious ploy, as is the right wing's cry that Obama, Rauf, and Hamas are on the same page.

Moderate Muslims chafe at being put into the same box with jihadis and other extremists. Right wingers jump into the box with them, however, because it holds any kind of close-mindedness, propaganda, xenophobia, and intolerance. That's one of the perpetual ironies of such self-righteous clashes. Both sides need each other, and in their declared hostility they pretend not to notice that each is pulling one end of the same rope. It's a sign of life returning to normal that most Americans aren't interested in joining the tug of war. With a majority saying that the imam has a right to build his center, the 39% who disagree or have no opinion amount to the same percentage, more or less, that Republicans, Tea Partiers, and the right in general manage to attract at this moment. In tough times, when people are unsettled already, offering a bogey man works.

If the same Islamic center had been proposed before 9/11, it wouldn't have attracted the slightest notice beyond zoning hearings. If it had been proposed the day after 9/11, one shudders to think about what Rauf would have been exposed to. But people are in a shadow zone right now, worried about terrorists, suspicious of Islam despite their best intentions, and jumpy about the Muslims among us who are doing nothing more dangerous than seeking a place to worship in their own way. Beneath the surface, it's really our own consciousness that remains in uncertainty. One looks forward to the day when Muslims are not forced into the same box with their irate counterparts on the opposite side. That box is too full already.

Published in the Washington Post

Deepak Chopra on Intent.com
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When people argue over religion, they tend to forget a simple question: Is it better to be happy or to be right? In societies that practice religious tolerance, the answer falls to the side of happine...
When people argue over religion, they tend to forget a simple question: Is it better to be happy or to be right? In societies that practice religious tolerance, the answer falls to the side of happine...
 
 
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04:09 PM on 08/20/2010
What do Newt Gingrich and Imam Rauf have in common? They're both jerks stirring up pain for no damn good reason.

Islam is not building the religious facility. Imam Rauf is. He is not Islam.

Ask yourself:

1. What if Christians made up 1 percent of the population?
2. What if crazed Evangelicals flew planes into the Twin Towers and only 1 out of 30 of the 3000 dead were Christians?
3. What if 10 years later a moderate Catholic wanted to build a religious facility on a site they couldn't have and wouldn't have chosen except for the atrocity?

Answer: The Jews and Muslims and Sikhs and Atheists who lost family, and the non-Christian country at large, who don't know much about Christianity, would associate the two groups wrongfully, and the religious facility would seem like a slap in the face, even though it's not meant to be.

And a cleric, a man of God, should not cause that much pain in order to demonstrate how non-violent and normal his faith is, or promote interfaith harmony, when he can move a few blocks away, reduce needless suffering, achieve the same goals, and continue his good works.

ANY decent cleric of ANY religion would feel that way. Rauf doesn't, and he's a jerk. This isn't that hard. Islam is not the problem. Imam Rauf is. Oh yeah. And so are Gingrich, and Palin and Lazio, but not Dean, because he gets it.
05:49 PM on 08/20/2010
What if Americans who are Muslim where treated with the same respect as Americans who are Christians? Answer:

The community center would be built and the community would be better for it. No one outside that community would ever know it was built.

This is not an issue. The imam did not make it an issue. Right wing propagandists made it an issue. Sorry, if you are looking to be the man in the middle by attacking both sides you end up on the wrong side of what are the facts.
06:20 PM on 08/20/2010
Yes, it would be lovely. And Imam Rauf is going to force that respect upon Americans by making 7 out of 10 of them upset.

I really wish this wasn't an issue. But there is a reasoned, non-bigoted, non-unconstitutional, non-"when they came for me, there was no one left", non-"if you had your way there'd still be Jim Crow," argument for opposing p$%^&ng off so many people, and playing into the hands of Palin and Gingrich etc., and I took my best shot at it above.

Maybe 7 out of 10 Americans, with an African American president, Muslim Miss America (insert your own ad infinitum list of evidence of religious, racial, ethnic, tolerance here) are hopeless bigots, or New York and the Country as a whole are reacting emotionally, and not intellectually, to something that still hurts after ten years, and Rauf is sticking his thumb in the wound when he doesn't have to.
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MalleusMaleficarum
Global nomad.
08:36 AM on 08/21/2010
JuanDimensional is living up to his name -- Imam Rauf is not simply building his community center near Ground Zero to irritate grief-stricken people -- he has been the imam of a mosque in lower Manhattan for 27 years, the Masjid Al-Jarah. That older mosque is now too small for the congregation, so a member of the congregation acquired the derelict Burlington Coat Factory, and the overflow has been meeting there for a while now without any complaints from the residents in Lower Manhattan. Now they want to build an Islamic Center just like the Jewish Center and the YMCA, and the local authorities and the Mayor have approved it almost unanimously. JuanDimensional is proposing to continue the discrimination, persecution and prejudice against Muslims that existed before 9/11 but intensified radically after the tragedy. Like Obama said, "This is America." If Cordoba House is moved -- it would be a dark day for America -- for it would be the end of religious freedom and the beginning of formalized religious persecution with a shiny new legal precedent for the persecutors. The peoples' feelings that Juan Dimensional and Howard Dean are concerned about are not simply grief -- they are experiencing grief tinged with Islamophobia, and they need therapy. Americans must never permit religious prejudice and bigotry to over-ride the freedoms enshrined in the Constitution.
01:21 PM on 08/20/2010
O God I am getting sick of all this so called outrage of how muslims are treated in america, its not like a mosque was burned down with 4 children in it. As a minority I would say they have gotten it easy compared to other groups i.e african americans and the top seeded but never mentioned native americans.
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hello All
05:41 PM on 08/20/2010
"As a minority I would say they have gotten it easy compared to other groups i.e african americans and the top seeded but never mentioned native americans."

Yeah! one should wait till a mosque is burn down with 4 children or one should wait till the treatment of Muslims is comparable to that of other minorities had undergone before the Muslims complain?

Sick mentality.
06:55 PM on 08/20/2010
I agree with you, wholeheartedly. Many muslim are also recent immigrants. Most immigrants have adjustments to make. People from all backgrounds, origins and religions were affected during 9/11 and still are. For some reason ONLY the feelings and rights of muslim are important and must be counted. No one else has any rights, not even to an opinion, let alone give expression to that opinion, unless, of course, they chime in to the one approved by the muslim community. What happened to freedom of speech?
10:29 PM on 08/20/2010
who said these things?
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DannyEV
10:38 PM on 08/20/2010
mommamia526 posted:

For some reason ONLY the feelings and rights of muslim are important and must be counted. No one else has any rights, not even to an opinion, let alone give expression to that opinion, unless, of course, they chime in to the one approved by the muslim community.

where are you getting that krap?
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BilaalUSA
02:38 PM on 08/19/2010
Comparing our Democracy to Saudi Arabia is like saying: "We'll stop stoning people for adultry here in America when they stop doing it in Arabia". This is the STANDARD that we should emulate? Really?
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BilaalUSA
02:33 PM on 08/19/2010
Close to 68% of Americans are opposed to the Islamic Center. The box is much larger than Deepak purports.
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gramma61
Anger is fear turned inward
11:29 AM on 08/20/2010
NOW these people decide to be against it? There was 9 years to have this area zoned as "hallowed ground" etc.It's not as if this is a newly announced project.
This isn't about the center.This is about hate..just plain hate and the people pushing it.
They hide behind the word "insensitive" but their real agenda is far more hateful and provocative.
http://sioaonline.com/
http://www.loonwatch.com/2010/07/sioa-is-an-anti-muslim-hate-group/
07:09 PM on 08/20/2010
What do you know about *hate* and who has it and who has not? There are 100 mosques in NY alone. No one is marching in front of any one of those, expressing hatred, or any other feelings, such as *go back to where you came from*. The latter sentence is one I have, as an immigrant, heard many times. The issue is not about the zoning of the area; it is about the building of an Islamic center at that specific site. *People* are allowed to have, and express, opinions on the issue, for or against, even neutral. Hatred is disallowing another's opinion, free speech, and the right to either agree, or disagree with an issue. We are just having a national discussion, for or against. Making pronouncements about *real agendas*, *hatred*, etc. without knowing whom you are speaking of is *judgement* without facts, condemnation and sentencing, without trial.

By the way, I am a Democrat, and have not put myself in any box, nor do I hate anyone. For anyone to make declaration about me, or any boxes I am in, and all the others similar demarcations are being made about, is rather presumptive and dumb. You do not know *THESE PEOPLE*. You do not know me, or what motivates me.
02:13 PM on 08/19/2010
Having read Aayan Hirsi Ali's stunning memoir, I agree this is a non-discussion. I don't remember thinking about Islam before 9/11, although the businesses in my heavily-Muslim neighborhood all had "Support the Intifada" posters in their store windows. Muslim shopkeepers, car-service drivers, and street peddlers wanted to discuss their feelings about Islam and the disagreement with the West. However, my Muslim doctor and dentist didn't have a word to say. So, is this a religious discussion or a class discussion? If you are looking at Islam objectively, we must look at it comparatively as well. Where the Catholic Church took a big hit for it's pervert priests, nobody seems to think the act of snipping off a little girl's clitoris and sewing up her vagina is that bad, even though it is an Islamic practice that occurs right here in this country behind closed doors. We can produce dubious works of art showing the crucifix in urine, yet even South Park can't get away with illustrating the prophet because they are seriously afraid of being murdered like anyone who criticizes Islam (hello Ms. Ali!) Religion is misogynistic, homophobic and hypocritical. The sooner we are allowed to speak about the criminal abuses performed in the name of these various Gods the sooner we as a world will live together more peacfully. Religion is a choice. Why buy second-hand what you already own?!
03:43 PM on 08/19/2010
Excellent!
07:27 PM on 08/20/2010
You had me nodding yes, yes, yes, until you made your statement about religion. If Aayan Hirsi Ali says this is a non-issue, I will have to read it. But it is certainly not an issue of religion, nor the free expression of it. We should not confuse religion with culture and law. However, culture and law are interwoven with religion, like it or not, and that applies to the three Abrahamic religions. The basis of law rests in the Bible, in Torah and in the Qur'an, and that basis is the same for all three. What is different is the interpretation of the Law and the emphasis.Culture is not identical, and not tied to religion, or Law per se. Other issues play into it.The three labels you stuck unto religion are not defining religion. Religion is defined by belief in an Energy (Power), represented as something we can understand, but it is not a man in the sky, how that Energy functions and what its declared laws are, such as do not murder, do not steal, etc. One aspect of Energy, and living, is procreation, hence the prohibition against behavioral aspects such as murder and homosexual acts. The feelings are not prohibited. Murder puts an end to life. Homosexuality does not create life. Criminality in the name of God, is not about God or religion; it is about evil and depravation.
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den1953
The best politicians are for free!
12:16 PM on 08/19/2010
Ask yourself one thing if the push by Karl Rove and the Bush team to push hatred for the Muslim people and the invasion of Iraq do you think Americans would have a better tolerance for the Muslim religion, do you suppose if Bush would have not put so much into the hunt Muslims down alive or dead or maybe that crusades catch phrase was a little bit to harsh? One thing i do know it got W re elected in 2004 perhaps the same tactic can work in 2010?
03:45 PM on 08/19/2010
9/11 happened prior to invasion of Iraq. After 9/11 not a single muslim was hurt in the US. So why do you assume "Americans" are so intolerant.
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den1953
The best politicians are for free!
09:42 AM on 08/21/2010
GW Bush had Iraq on the table for a invasion prior to 9/11 and used 9/11 for a excuse along with 100 other excuses to invade Iraq try to be more informed!
11:39 PM on 08/19/2010
den1953, Does the date October 23, 1983 mean anything to you? What about the date March 17, 1992 or February 26, 1993 mean anything to you? Look them up. Fill in the blanks. Add your own dates.
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den1953
The best politicians are for free!
09:40 AM on 08/21/2010
Would the sale of SAM missiles to the Afghan Freedom fighters mean anything to you and those freedom fighters were supplied by Ronald Reagan to fight against the Soviet Union , yes those freedom fighters of Afghanistan turned out to be al-Qaida!
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10:56 AM on 08/19/2010
The arguments we're seeing are not about a "mosque at Ground Zero." They are clearly about fear and ignorance. These people do not want to hear the truth about Islam or anything else. Their need to hate is so strong that they react violently to any attempt to reason with them. I am perplexed by this phenomenon, and I can only wonder how damaged these people are, that their need to feel hatred is so strong.
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Marcus01
It all just seems like it's real
11:30 AM on 08/19/2010
It really all comes down to consciousness. Many people simply aren't very expansive in their consciousness. They are functional human beings but their field of awareness does not extend very far due to the limitations of their conscious state. This is not a condemnation, it just is as it is.

The clinical psychiatrist Dr David Hawkins wrote a fascinating book on the topic, Power vs Force: The Hidden Determinants of Human Behavior.
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Marcus01
It all just seems like it's real
09:57 AM on 08/19/2010
Interesting non-discussion going on here.

On one hand, there are people who understand the Constitution and lofty principles this country was founded upon.

On the other hand, there are people so trapped by their fears and prejudices that they can't for a moment consider how those principles actually apply.

Like I said, a non-discussion.
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10:57 AM on 08/19/2010
Yes. It might perhaps become a discussion if we focus on the underlying issues of hatred and fear, but of course those who are caught up in it are going to be the last to respond to reason.
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tyruler
11:07 AM on 08/19/2010
Very very well said. thx.
09:13 AM on 08/19/2010
The out of context comments by Khomeini or Churchill are immaterial. Muslims have the same religious and property rights as Baptists, Catholics, Mormons or any other of the many faiths practiced in America. At the same time, everyone has a right to an opinion. My neighbors and friends make choices that I myself might not make and I can express my dissatisfaction with these choices, but I cannot impose my beliefs on them. While I am not religious myself, I hope other churches, temples, etc. are built in the area. It sends a message that as Americans, we will not veer from the principles of religious freedom.
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09:26 AM on 08/19/2010
OK, buy some land in Saudi Arabia and build a Church, or better yet, build a Shia mosque.
09:40 AM on 08/19/2010
That is not our concern here. We live in the United States, and OUR constitution guarantees religious freedom.
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Marcus01
It all just seems like it's real
09:41 AM on 08/19/2010
And that is somehow relevant to the USA and the principles it was founded upon?
09:10 AM on 08/19/2010
That's the problem. You have all these Muslims coming forward, proclaiming to love the USA, denouncing terrorism. Then you have all these terrorists who are Muslims blowing themselves up, killing hundreds in the process.
They say it's a religion of peace, but in my lifetime it's been nothing but an agent of death, destruction, and murder.
Which is it?
10:14 AM on 08/19/2010
Well, let's see. There are 1.6 billion Muslims in the world. How many have been agents of death, destruction and murder?

If you honestly answer that question, you'll see that Islam is not a religion of death, destruction and murder any more than any other religion or creed is. The fact that there are some nuts--some criminal nuts--who use Islam as an excuse for their violence notwithstanding.
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tyruler
11:10 AM on 08/19/2010
By your logic, Iraqis can rightly claim (more so than you since more have died thanks to American invasion) that all Americans are a curse of violence, fanatical, empirical, oil-hungry, pro-Israeli warmongers who have declared war on Muslims all over the world, including Lebanon, Gaza, Somalia, Yemem, Afghanistan, and now threatening Iran.
08:54 AM on 08/19/2010
Problem is we cannot find any Moderate Muslims who are willing to confront the extremist element in their faith, but I understand, they are scared.
10:15 AM on 08/19/2010
That's what Rauf has been doing for years and what he wants to continue to do with this project!

We lament not hearing from the moderates (I prefer to call them the mainstream of Islam) but when we do we tell them to sit down, shut up, move to the back of the bus.
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tyruler
11:16 AM on 08/19/2010
Wrong! We the majority of Muslims, aren't scared anymore "moderate Americans" (whatever the heck that means) are scared of violent criminals who go on regular gun rampages in churches, schools, colleges, workplaces, etc.

There will ALWAYS be criminals in any society and they will act, irrespective of how you many police there are or how you feel about their act.

But to draw a gross generalization upon an entire people (African Americans 4 example), entire country, or an entire religion based on those aberrational acts, you become a small-minded, sterotyping bigot.
01:12 PM on 08/19/2010
Hey leave the African Americans out of it, fight your own battles we had to.
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VA Magoo
08:11 AM on 08/19/2010
Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini

"Those who know nothing about Islam pretend that Islam counsels against war. Those people are witless. Islam says: 'Kill all the unbelievers just as they would kill you all!' Does this mean that Muslims should sit back until they are devoured by the infidel? Islam says: 'Kill them, put them to the sword and scatter them.' Islam says: 'Whatever good there is exists thanks to the sword.' The sword is the key to Paradise, which can be opened only for the Holy Warriors! Does all this mean that Islam is a religion that prevents men from waging war? I spit upon those foolish souls who make such a claim."
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09:20 AM on 08/19/2010
Bravo! The real Islam exposed. Recall Saddam built two sword sculpture in Bagdad. Islam has always existed by sword, and always will.
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tyruler
11:23 AM on 08/19/2010
Yes always existed by the sword (false propaganda) that's why ISLAM in the world's largest Muslim countries (Indonesia, India, Bangladesh) was spread by Sufi mystics and trade merchants.

You can 'scare' people by the sword and bombs (but they'll always resist and not believe in their hearts), but touch their hearts and that's how they'll profess faith forever.

Now lets go bomb them some more after 'freeing them' in Iraq, since they elected a pro-Ayatollah government.

The lies and hatred bout Islam that these bigots peddle would be laughable if it weren't affecting policy and our Constitutional freedoms.
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Marcus01
It all just seems like it's real
10:38 AM on 08/19/2010
Onward Christian soldiers, LOL.
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VA Magoo
08:11 AM on 08/19/2010
Sir Winston Churchill

"Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities, but the influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those who follow it.

No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing faith. It has already spread throughout Central Africa, raising fearless warriors at every step..."
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jmwtex
12:11 PM on 08/19/2010
The same can be said about Christians and Christianity, truely!!
07:56 AM on 08/19/2010
Someone tell the "moderate Muslims" to stand up and be counted.
06:04 AM on 08/19/2010
Dr.Chopra, yours is a voice of reason. Sorry to inform you that today the voice of reason is a voice in the wilderness. Not just in the US, but globally.

BTW, I like our metaphor of the rope: "That's one of the perpetual ironies of such self-righteous clashes. Both sides need each other, and in their declared hostility they pretend not to notice that each is pulling one end of the same rope."

In other words, the jihadists and right-wingers are playing the same demonizing game. Too often, when people say, "Look, there's the devil," they are pointing at an image in a mirror.
08:00 AM on 08/19/2010
True, well noticed.
All thats happening may well tricle down to some mountain village of ignorant illiterate fools where a qaeda spokesman clains: You see these americans they hate us, how long till they break our mosques in afganistan...and probably add more salt and lies to the issue just as haters on the western side are doing. Except well they happen to be on the more outspoken and lawless part of the world with a history of unstabilituy and violence (not helped by mindgames between the USA and USSR beforey they gained some sovereighnity)
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06:00 PM on 08/19/2010
"That's one of the perpetual ironies of such self-righteous clashes. Both sides need each other, and in their declared hostility they pretend not to notice that each is pulling one end of the same rope."

That's usually the way it is in a war.