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Ian Fletcher

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Is Herman Cain Any Good on Trade? You Try Figuring It Out

Posted: 10/07/2011 9:23 pm

Maybe Herman Cain, the latest boomlet in the Republican presidential race, will be elected president. Or maybe his 15 minutes of fame have just arrived.

Either way, it behooves us to see what he thinks about America's trade mess.

There are some encouraging signs. For a start, here's what he wrote in his column about China earlier this year:

China's economic dominance would represent a national security threat to the USA, and possibly to the rest of the world.


Look at the facts. China has a billion more people than we do. They aspire to have a greater military might than we do. They currently hold over 25 percent of our national debt. And they have a different view of human rights and how to maintain peace in the world.

It would be naïve to think that China would not be tempted to flex its worldly might if it were bigger than us economically and militarily. And it would be equally naïve to think we could influence their actions on currency or anything else with diplomacy or two verses of Kumbaya.

Appeasement is not a strategy. As Ronald Reagan proved, strength is the strategy. Both the Bush and Obama administrations have shown that appeasement just buys the Chinese more time to talk until they can equal us in size and might.

So far, so good. He seems way beyond the "let's all hold hands and do business together" nonsense that the Obama administration, and half his Republican rivals (notable exceptions being Mitt Romney, maybe, and Buddy Roemer, for sure) believe in.

But keep reading, because there's a problem. He goes on to say:

Our China strategy should be two simple words. Outgrow them!


There is no doubt that we can outgrow China, but right now we lack the leadership with the courage to propose and implement aggressive economic growth strategies.

Now with all due respect to Mr. Cain and our beloved U.S. economy, this is preposterous.

China has been averaging growth nearing 10 percent a year for three decades now. The U.S. has never grown that fast, ever, except for exceptional periods like 1941 to 1945, when we ramped our economy out of Depression by the brute force of military spending. Even in our own glory days of the late 19th century, when we were the new industrial big boy on the block, our economy didn't grow that fast. We grew faster than the 1-3 percent we expect today, but not as fast as China is growing now.

The basic reality is that China grows as fast as it does mainly because it is a developing country that can grow simply by catching up to the technological standards of the already-developed nations. Every time someone in China moves from toiling in a medieval rice paddy to working in a modern factory, their output doubles. Every time someone in China is the first member of their family to go to college, their output goes up.

But 99% of the U.S. population is already living in the modern world economically, so these easy gains aren't an option for us.

Every other developed nation is in the same boat. This is why Germany's growth slowed after the Wirtschaftswunder ("economic miracle") of the 1950s and 1960s, when the nation was recovering from the economic primitiveness imposed by the B-17. It's why Japan's growth slowed after about 1990. And it's why even China's growth will slow one day.

There's absolutely no mystery here, and it's dangerous nonsense to imagine that the U.S. could somehow match China's growth rate if only we tuned our economic engine a bit better. Sure, we can do better than we're currently doing. But matching Chinese growth is a fool's errand.

So why does Herman Cain want to try? Reading a little further in his column supplies a plausible answer:

We need to lower corporate tax rates, starting with dropping the top rate from 35 percent to 25 percent. We are the only nation on the planet that has not lowered its corporate tax rates in more than 15 years. And people wonder why so many jobs have left the USA.


It's not just cheaper labor in more business-friendly nations. It's also taxes!

We must lower the capital gains tax rate to zero. Suspend taxes on repatriated foreign profits. Give every worker in America a 6.2 percent raise and every business a cost break by suspending the payroll tax for a year. Then! Make the tax rates permanent until they are lowered again in the future to remove this veil of uncertainty hanging over our economy.

Yes, these are aggressive proposals. It's going to take aggressive leadership in the White House to get it done. It won't be easy. But I don't avoid doing what's right just because it's going to be difficult to achieve. That's not in my DNA.

We can outgrow China because the USA is not a loser nation. We just need a winner in the White House.

Aha! So it's all really a pitch for lower corporate and capital gains taxes! Supposedly, if we cut taxes enough (and perhaps, to be fair, do a few other things he doesn't mention here), we can outgrow China.

Sorry, but this is delusional. If Cain really means it, we are in economic Dr. Strangelove territory here.

Granted, America needs reasonable tax rates to prosper. Excessive taxation is an economic drag, and Republicans are entitled to embrace a Republican definition of what "excessive" is. But the idea that we can tax-cut our way to double-digit compound growth is absurd, and peddling this nonsense to push corporate tax cuts is either extremely cynical or an insult to the intelligence of the American voter.

Now let's look at what Cain has said specifically about trade. He has reportedly said:

Uncle Sam has got to stop being Uncle Sucker. We don't need "free trade" where other countries get rich at our expense, but "fair trade" where everyone plays by the same rules and everyone benefits.

Hmm... This sounds good, but we've still got a number of problems here.

For a start, he says he's against free trade. That's good. But "fair" trade where nations behave according to "the same rules" is a bit of a problem -- for the simple reason that it's extremely unlikely to happen with nations that view trade as adversarial and don't share our conceptions of fairness.

Who's going to decide what's fair and enforce it on a nuclear power with three trillion dollars in its bank account?

The standard answer here is "the WTO." But we tried that. The whole history of the WTO since its founding in 1995 is one long object lesson in the impossibility of global free trade based on shared rules of fairness.

Far better to demand of our trading partners something like reciprocity, which is an arithmetical concept independent of political culture or shared values. Even the Soviets understood reciprocity when it was backed up with credible power.

Cain exhibited the same frustrating mix of sense and nonsense in an interview at the Conservative Political Action Conference:

Interviewer: On free trade, do you support NAFTA, do you support CAFTA, do you support these free trade agreements? Where do you stand on trade?


Herman Cain: There are parts of NAFTA and CAFTA that I support, but I am sure that there are parts that I don't support, so I can't give you a specific answer. Basically though, I do support free trade agreements that are done correctly, where we don't give away more than we gain.

And the reason is because we truly are in a global economy. It doesn't make sense to be protectionist in a global economy the way we have.

Secondly, the fact that we've lost so many jobs to other countries... One of the ways to help with jobs in our own economy is to have good free trade agreements with our friends. Not these one-sided ones, but good trade agreements with other countries around the world.

So, bottom line, where does Herman Cain stand? I honestly can't tell, because there's enough wiggle room in the above statements to drive a container ship through.

If interpreted the right way, they constitute a formula for serious reform of NAFTA and our other trade agreements. Cain seems to understand, for one thing, that mutual gains from freer trade are not automatic, but depend on successful U.S. negotiating.

If interpreted the wrong way, they constitute an Obama-style formula for pretending to be serious about trade reform while not being so.

I'm especially worried about that line about we can't be protectionist because we're in a global economy. The fact of a globalized economy doesn't, on its own, settle anything about protectionism vs. free trade. This is as vacuous as Thomas Friedman.

Mr. Cain, you're showing a few signs of promise on this issue, but also a lot of signs that give pause. Speak up, and let us all know where you really stand.

 
 
 
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BlueGirlRedState
C'est la vie
10:42 AM on 10/09/2011
Herman Cain doesn't have a clue where he stands on free trade because he is devoid of knowledge and understanding it. He said, "I'm sure there are points I agree with..." but doesn't name even one. The better question would be whether he's even read the NAFTA and CAFTA Agreements. It's fairly obvious that someone else wrote the first part of the article and Cain picked up when it came to cutting corporate taxes...it's doubtful he understands the ramifications of that, but he has that "just do it" mentality. He's a money grabber and doesn't concern himself with cause and effect.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
imfedup
Fight the lies.
09:09 AM on 10/09/2011
Reduce capital gains tax to ZERO? REALLY?

The current low capital gains rate is the primary reason Buffett pays a lower percentage than his secretary! I thought we all "got" that this was grossly unfair and unacceptable. Guess not!
oilfield
large employer per obamacare
12:28 PM on 10/09/2011
buffet barely sells, so he pays 0....buy and hold, read his books.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
imfedup
Fight the lies.
09:55 PM on 10/09/2011
Buy and hold is a strategy you use when you're in the earlier stages of the investment curve. He's re-investing and donating, and to do that he has to sell.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
imfedup
Fight the lies.
09:56 PM on 10/09/2011
And he doesn't pay 0.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
imfedup
Fight the lies.
09:05 AM on 10/09/2011
There are parts I support, and I'm sure there are parts I don't support?

Translation: I don't know enough about what NAFTA and CAFTA provide to comment.

This reminds me of Sarah Palin's answer to Katie Couric's question about SCOTUS decisions she disagrees with. There have been many decisions in this great country of ours, and I agree with some of them and I'm sure I disagree with some of them . . .
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Pelican1983
Eat your peas!
09:57 PM on 10/08/2011
Mr. Fletcher, excellent article on the strengths and weaknesses of Herman Cain. Fair and balanced, imo.

One thing I will say for Mr. Cain is, even if some of his answers are alarming, he at least knows what NAFTA is and is aware of the growing power of China...that's more than we've seen in the past from some of the GOP!

At first, I dismissed Mr. Cain as a candidate. However, I'm now starting to wonder, since the GOP pool is so incredibly weak, if they might not elevate him in the hopes that every Repubican will vote for him, and pray for the possibility that he may siphon off some of the African-American vote from Obama.

Let's hope this doesn't happen. I think Mr. Cain is an astute godfather of pizza, but he can't deliver in the White House.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
imfedup
Fight the lies.
09:06 AM on 10/09/2011
I don't see any evidence that he knows what NAFTA is.
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Pelican1983
Eat your peas!
10:03 PM on 10/09/2011
I more than likely gave Cain too much credit.

A better way to put it would have been, "When Cain was questioned about NAFTA, he didn't say, "What's that?"
oilfield
large employer per obamacare
12:29 PM on 10/09/2011
the 9 9 9 plan would simplify taxes for all and have a system that is fairer.
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Pelican1983
Eat your peas!
10:05 PM on 10/09/2011
I'll have to look that plan up, I'm not familiar with it.

I'm assuming we're on the 666 plan now...
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RedneckDem
The top 1% stole my made in china bootstraps
08:57 PM on 10/08/2011
We could knock 8% off of China's growth just by buying American. Too bad we can hardly find anything anymore...

Instead of selling out all of our jobs, large American and multi-national corporations could have spent 50 years in China and India teaching them how to serve their won 2 billion+ population thru infrastructure and technology.
oilfield
large employer per obamacare
12:30 PM on 10/09/2011
we should have let them figure it out on their own....but there is no money in that.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Jorge Escondido
07:25 PM on 10/08/2011
In light of Obama signing a huge free trade deal with south korea, shipping our jobs overseas, do you know where you (the Obama supporter) stands?
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RedneckDem
The top 1% stole my made in china bootstraps
08:52 PM on 10/08/2011
You do realize that we can still support Obama, but disagree with him on specific issues???
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
rksnj67
Illegitimi non carborundum
10:47 PM on 10/08/2011
GOP/TBaggers don't understand that concept. They have to be in 100% lockstep to be acceptable.
oilfield
large employer per obamacare
12:31 PM on 10/09/2011
i dont think 0 knows.
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SteveM39
That's how dad did it, that's how America does it
04:59 PM on 10/08/2011
I like the realization that the US must grow out of many of its problems. We have decimated many areas of our economy and have to rebuild and lay a foundation to support growth.

We don't need to outgrown China on a percentage basis to stay ahead of China. 2% of 50 is the same as 10% of 10.

And after 40 plus years of growth in non-productive areas we have tremendous potential to grow in manufacturing. And technolgy offers growth potential far exceeding traditional historical rates. Considering the assets available we should have record stable growth year in and year out.

But Cain's suggestions to achieve growth are as old and worn out as medieval farming techniques. The US has aggregated wealth to the top. The wealthy have capital coming out the wazoo and no place to put it for a decent return. So it churns and creates artificial markets while the real Main Street market is dying.

Instead of buying derivatives and derivatives of derivatives, we have to get investment outside of Wall St moving again. Education has to be improved. Our best and brightest can not create the technology or investment opportunities of tomorrow buried in student loan debt. We have to invest in infrastructure to maintain the capability to support a growing economy. We have to invest in our people to have the labor needed to have the productivity gains to sustain that growth.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
rationalitymatters
Captain of my Soul
06:33 PM on 10/08/2011
Your last paragraph is very perceptive. It is imperative that we invest in education and the infrastructure. I have read so many articles lately about employers bemoaning the fact that they can't fill their companys' positions because so many Americans lack the technological education required. It's becoming a real problem.
11:08 PM on 10/15/2011
Sounds Clintonesque. Where to begin? I'm in I.T. Technology, done well, makes thing easier and not more complicated. If a company position requires increasing technical expertise than the newer technologies are inferior and backward. Moreover, human resources personnel frequently have the least amount of skills within a company and are frequently unable to recognize talent. It takes talent to recognize talent. They don't. One of the fastest ways to turn around a company is to revamp HR strategies and actually make evaluations on how talented and smart recruits are. I'll go further, it would be a far more effective to apprentice a talented genius from high school, rather than hiring some random certification from the training that rationalitymatters advocates,
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HUFFPOST PUNDIT
hypnotoad72
Real democracy = living wages.
04:25 PM on 10/08/2011
Cain, so many jobs have left because politicians vote to give them taxpayer money to do so.  Some politicians vote 'no' to rescind bills that would stop giving such WELFARE to those large corporations.

Like these guys:
http://www.ontheissues.org/john_mccain.htm#Corporations
http://www.ontheissues.org/senate/mitch_mcconnell.htm#Corporations
http://www.ontheissues.org/senate/Rick_Santorum.htm#Corporations
http://www.ontheissues.org/senate/jim_demint.htm#Corporations

Our taxes give these guts lots of handouts... tax cuts too.  Because "tax cuts create jobs" - and if they didn't work last decade, it was embarrassing for presidential hopefuls for election 2012 saying the same cock'n'bull story.

So don't give us empty baloney, Cain.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
guitargeorge1964
Independent!!!
12:17 PM on 10/08/2011
Someone should point out to Mr Cain that how Reagan dealt with the Soviets would be completely impossible at this time with the Chinese. The Soviet system was already close to bankruptcy at the time Reagan took office. He just pushed them on the arms race and it collapsed. The Chinese are still in the infancy stages of their economy why we're closer to where the Soviets were in 1980. They will grow and grow and we'll still be arguing about who's paying their fair share of taxes.
Look at the headline right now about Syria killing funeral protesters. If certain people have their way, that will be our next military intervention. The Chinese will be on the sideline ready to "loan" us the money to pay for it.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
sunshineclaimsfl
12:03 PM on 10/08/2011
Cain says nothing, offers nothing, and the writer desperately tries to find some shread of something he can actually hang on to. The one thing we can get from this is that Cain is out for the rich capitalists. 6% raise for workers? R U Kidding me?, well lets do the math. If your unemployed 6% X nothing = nothing. If you are making 30,000 a year x.06 = 1800.00 divide this by 12 is 150.00 per month, then take away taxes and medical deductions etc what are you left with? still nothing...So who is he kidding. BTW suspend payroll taxes for a year. Would this not break Social security? Suspend taxes on repatriated foreign profits. Lets see now, does this really mean ...all the money you rich guys squirreled out of the US to avoid paying taxes, somehow invested now into foreign investments and now are looking for another free way to get it into the US. Am I wrong to assume this is not a form of money laundering? This guy is false... I bet he never flipped a pizza in his life...
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HUFFPOST PUNDIT
hypnotoad72
Real democracy = living wages.
04:27 PM on 10/08/2011
Suspending payroll taxes for ay ear may not crush social security, but a dent WILL be made as a result - unless funding is taken from other programs, but I don't see the Pentagon willing to give up a little.  I mean, they need the money so soldiers can fight for American ideals...  I wonder what those ideals are, since a happy middle class doesn't seem to be one of those anymore... even with all the subsidy, atx cuts, bailouts, etc, that corporations and banks get.

Bonus:
http://abcnews.go.com/Business/strangling-middle-class-america/story?id=11325933

Fanned and faved
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
rationalitymatters
Captain of my Soul
06:37 PM on 10/08/2011
The only applicable critique of Cain's tax plan is that the rich have everything to gain and the middleclass everything to lose. The tax burden will fall heavily on the backs of the middleclass.
11:56 AM on 10/08/2011
In the article the author quotes Mr. Cain as saying:
"We must lower the capital gains tax rate to zero. Suspend taxes on repatriated foreign profits. "

Neither of these ideas is sensible. There needs to be a tax base, and there has to be a sense of fairness. It is true that capital gains, or certain types, are representative of a type of economic activity that has broader benefits to society and it is justifiable to have a lower tax rate than on wage income. That type of capital gains is where an owner operates a business that employs people. Other types of capital gains do not have the same positive societal effect and should not get a tax break...these include things like capital gains on widely held stocks, real estate inflation, and the like.

Mr. Cain's second point is bizarre. He recommends building in a tax advantage to companies having operations outside the United States. He recommends a tax policy to promote job loss in this country. It is a wonder that Republicans are considered somehow to be economically savy or to be somehow the party that creates jobs. With statements like that nothing could be further from the truth. It is a policy designed to increase unemployment and depress wages at the bottome end of the scale.
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HUFFPOST PUNDIT
hypnotoad72
Real democracy = living wages.
04:28 PM on 10/08/2011
Your second paragraph says it all. 

Cain is a sellout.

Fanned and faved.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
rationalitymatters
Captain of my Soul
06:17 PM on 10/08/2011
The theory that I suspect is accurate, is that a high capital gains tax discourages investment, because stock holders are reluctant to buy and sell due to the capital gains tax that's imposed. I'm certainly not wealthy by any means, but I do own some stocks and mutual funds and I was always scared to sell because I didn't want to incur capital gains taxes. However, this is why a secretary pays more in taxes than the CEO she works for; most of the employer's wealth is in investments and, therefore, he/she pays a lower tax rate overall than the secretary who only has wages to tax. If the capital gains tax rate is reduced to zero, the wealthy will be dancing in the streets and drowning themselves in champagne. And even more of the tax burden will fall onto the backs of the middleclass.
11:06 AM on 10/08/2011
I say stick with Buddy Roemer who understands the root causes of high unemployment in the US Political lobbistlobbist influences and unbalanced trade.

All the candidates that continue to preach lower Corp taxes don't seem to understand that when you lower taxes you have higher deficits.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Carl Caroli
I just don't understand people
10:48 AM on 10/08/2011
Herman says whatever is convenient at the moment. There is no serious thread, no continuity, from one thought to the other, like all the rest of these candidates and pretty much all of our representatives, Obama included. They're too busy trying to appease CEOs, not forming good policy designed to keep American workers employed. They're all sellouts for campaign dollars. We need to fix tht before we can have a serious discussion about trade with other nations.
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HUFFPOST PUNDIT
hypnotoad72
Real democracy = living wages.
04:28 PM on 10/08/2011
Well said, thanks!
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muysuave41
Spanish Olive Oil Producer
03:58 AM on 10/08/2011
Granted, the American policy for the last 30-years has been to give away the store so to speak. There is no reason to believe the policy will change in the future.
This user has chosen to opt out of the Badges program
02:36 AM on 10/08/2011
Wasn't this guy part of the KC fed? He is part of the problem and is not the solution to anything, he will sell you and this country down the river rather then look at you , his soul comes cheap.