An Introduction To Kabbalah, Part 3: Three Answers To The Ultimate Question

Last week, in part two of our introduction to Kabbalah, we suggested that in Jewish mystical theology, "God does not exist -- God is existence itself." But then we ended by asking if this is true, if everything is God, why do things appear as they do? And what are we supposed to do about it? What is the best use of our time as human beings?

Kabbalah, the centuries-old system of Jewish mysticism and esotericism, offers three types of answers to these questions. The answers are not contradictory but are, at the very least, three different perspectives on how a unitary world appears as multiplicity, and what to do about it. These three types of answers are found in three distinct streams of Kabbalah: what scholars call theosophical Kabbalah, prophetic/ecstatic Kabbalah, and practical/magical Kabbalah. These categories are not hard and fast, but the distinctions are productive ones, so let's take a look.

1. Theosophical Kabbalah

The most well-known and influential stream of Kabbalah is theosophical Kabbalah -- or what Kabbalists themselves call "Kabbalah of the sefirot" (we'll get to that term in a moment.) "Theosophical" here refers not to the early-20th century occultist movement, but to the principle that it is possible to know the nature of God. Thus, classic theosophical texts of the Kabbalah, such as the Zohar, talk about the "shape" of the Godhead, how our actions influence and mirror the Divine, how the nature of the world reflects the Divine reality and so on. By gradually developing and deepening this esoteric knowledge, the spiritually adept come to see the manifest world as perhaps the skin of the Divine, beneath which are endlessly deep layers of symbol and myth.

Theosophical Kabbalah's central symbolic structure is that of the ten sefirot -- an untranslatable word, sometimes rendered as "emanations," the neo-Platonic term for the stages of development from unity to multiplicity. One helpful metaphor is to think of the sefirot as ten different panes of stained glass through which the Infinite Light -- the ohr ein sof -- shines. For many theosophical texts, the world exists and appears as it does because God manifests through these sefirot, which both contain God's Light and, to speak in metaphor, dimmed or colored it in increasing degrees. Indeed, by the time this "light" reaches the final sefirah, Malchut, it can appear to us that it is completely concealed.

Experientially, learning theosophical Kabbalah transforms our understanding of the world; everything, every word, every moment is like a symbol for a ripple in the Godhead. As the deep structure of reality is uncovered, through ever greater sensitivity to and immersion in the Kabbalah's symbolic structure, our consciousness expands. In every blade of grass is the entire universe. For theosophical Kabbalah, we might say the life well lived is that which is subtly attuned to these symbolic structures and enriched by that knowledge. We will explore the sefirot in detail, and take a look at some key theosophical texts in future installments.

2. Prophetic Kabbalah

The second stream of Kabbalah is the prophetic Kabbalah (kabbalah nevuit), sometimes called "ecstatic Kabbalah" because it contains spiritual practices that lead to ecstatic mystical states. Until the 20th century, no Kabbalists used this term, for them the point was not the ecstatic states themselves, but the prophecy that could be obtained through them. The prophetic Kabbalah, most importantly in the writings of Abraham Abulafia, contains meditation practices, symbolic associations and what we might today understand as stream-of-consciousness writing for attaining union with the Divine.

Notice the difference in approach between prophetic Kabbalah and theosophical Kabbalah. Prophetic Kabbalah is about cultivating mystical experiences to obtain hidden knowledge. Theosophical Kabbalah is about studying and learning esoteric secrets. As scholar Melila Helner-Eshed has recently shown, this "studying" is itself a mystical experience, but the distinction still holds. Prophetic Kabbalah also uses the conceptual structure of the sefirot, but focuses less on understanding complex mythical and symbolic structures and more on techniques for altering the mind in order to open it to God. Language plays an essential role in both systems: the Hebrew Alphabet is seen as the underlying structure of the universe, a sort of "periodic table" which contains all the elements of the cosmos. In theosophical Kabbalah, language is mined for its symbolic associations. In prophetic Kabbalah, those associations themselves become grist for generating mystical experience.

In Abulafia's Maimonidean terminology, the insights one receives when the mind is warmed up by ecstatic practice come from the Active Intellect, the wisdom of the Divine which shapes and maintains the universe, and they -- not the experience itself -- are why the practices are important. In the practices of prophetic Kabbalah, the individual soul is annihilated. Once its illusory self is seen to be nothing but illusion, the world is experienced as nothing but the Divine Light, and one has access to the radiance of this Light, which is the source of prophecy. More than theosophical Kabbalah, prophetic Kabbalah closely resembles the mystical practices of other religious traditions, with meditation practices and other means of cleansing the doors of perception so that they can accept the Infinite. For prophetic Kabbalah, the best use of our time is cultivating states of higher consciousness so that we can have knowledge of God.

3. Practical Kabbalah

Third and last of the Kabbalistic "answers" of why the world is the way it is, and what to do about it, is that of practical Kabbalah (kabbalah ma'asit), sometimes called magical Kabbalah or theurgical Kabbalah. On the basic level, this form of Kabbalah contains a bewildering array of mythical and magical teachings: demons, angels, golems, amulets, spells, you name it. But we can understand practical Kabbalah thematically by putting it in the context of our original question of unity and multiplicity -- how the Infinite One relates to the finite many.

We might say that theosophical Kabbalah is concerned primarily with the relationship of finite to infinite, prophetic Kabbalah with how to unite with the infinite, and practical Kabbalah about how to manipulate the finite. Prophetic Kabbalah is the "up there," practical the "down here," and theosophical the relationship between the two. Of course, this is a very crude reduction of a thousand years of religious cultivation, but after all, we are only on installment 3.

Practical Kabbalah includes various esoteric practices such as divination, doctrines such as the transmigration of souls -- a lively world of angels and demons -- and legends such as the Golem. Theosophical and ecstatic Kabbalists tend to denigrate magic to them; however, it is moving in the wrong direction. Still, some of the oldest Kabbalistic texts we have are magical formulas and incantations, and the most popular forms of Kabbalah today make heavy use of magic. In Israel, Kabbalistic healers offer remedies for everything from infertility to depression, and in America, the Kabbalah Centre makes magical use of the Zohar and various talismans.

Practical Kabbalah is enormously popular, and not surprisingly. Because of the three streams, it is the most concerned with influencing the life we are leading here on Earth: protecting us from harm and giving us the keys to worldly success. Whether these keys actually work, well, that's for you to decide. But remember, for keys to work, you've got to use them to open doors.

In a sense, these three "answers" are really three approaches to how we are to live. This "life advice" may take the form of quasi-magical techniques that may heal us, or ecstatic practices that may give us equanimity and liberate us from the endless cycle of desire and suffering, or theosophical intentions that transform our daily consciousness. In all cases, to truly study Kabbalah is to live it, to bring its wisdom into our every act, and to understand ourselves in light of its truths. Before moving on to the details of these three systems, next week we'll pause to explore how Kabbalah does this -- how it can work as a spiritual practice for those of us who are not medieval rabbis but contemporary folks like you and me.

Read The Full Series: An Introduction To Kabbalah

• Part 1: What Is Kabbalah?


• Part 2: God Does Not Exist, God Is Existence Itself

 

 

Follow Jay Michaelson on Twitter: www.twitter.com/jaymichaelson

Comments

[elmerfude]

@minimalist. This is one of the three theories of the crucifixio­n/resurrec­tion I am working on . This one is the shamanic-dramatic theory summarized. In the shamanic-dramatic theory, the crucifixio­n-resurrec­tion story of Christ is a dramatic reenactment of the shamanic death-rebirth trance flight. Shamanism revolves around the three-day trance flight of the shaman that acts out the death-rebirth parabola in trance state. The shamanic three-day episode contains within it many analogies to the elements of Christ story including analogies to baptism in water, sacramental blood offering, piercing and death, descent into the tomb (underworld), ascension to the heavenly great spirit with assistance by animal or human familiars often female, earthly return and reconstitution of the body. In shamanism the ascension up the tree of life (the cross in Christianity) is a key feature. The difference between the shamanic parabola and the Christ crucifixio­n-resurrec­tion sequence is that for shamans the cycle occurs in trance state whereas in literal Christian understanding, Christ literally undergoes the cycle. The shamanic cycle theory is consistent with certain scientific understandings of how the creation works including the cycling of matter-ene­rgy-intell­igence. It is also consistent with the mythological concept of the hero journey and the romantic narrative archetype in literature.

[minimalist syntax]

I am going to post a response much later today because it is very late right now even with daylight savings time. I have some definitely ideas in response to what you wrote.

[minimalist syntax]

This is going to take me a little longer than I thought.

[minimalist syntax]

I am really intrigued by the idea of women "familiars". I also want to connect some of your ideas to the Greek tragedy:Alcestis, which I think is an inverted story of Christ. I am not finding a good amount of time to sit down and carefully think this through because of all these papers I have due, but I hope to do this very soon.

[elmerfude]

@minimalist "So for example, since Christ was baptized in the River Jordan, this act sanctified all of water." This really appeals to me. (I just had an angel at the door asking for candy. So cute.) Anyway I would be tempted to go further to say that Christ is the human metaphor for all water. Christ is water (and all of nature.) I realize this sounds very esoteric and beyond discussing here probably. I am really going to have to look at eastern Orthodox. As kwinter likes to tell me, my religion changes every day so why not. I also like the notion that you just cannot say you believe but also you have to participate. This is why I found the mass so intriguing at least for awhile because it is clearly based in shamanic practice that goes to the very root of our relationship with nature. Alas i just could not abide all the other stuff the church brought with it and of course my interpretation of the sacrament was completely different than the church. But I have developed my own liturgy. I will try to post a few things from the manuscript I am working on for you to comment on.

[minimalist syntax]

We didn't have anyone until 8:45 when all the college kids started trick or treating- that was actually cute as well--(they still like to get candy!)
I have never thought about it exactly this way before. But my first reaction would be in the world as I understand it, there is a fundamental distinction between the creator and the creatures/created and it is the quest of humans to find their way to the divine. To acquire the divine. But nature itself, outside of humans, I would need to think about that--it would not need to acquire any more sanctity. It seems that only humans can choose to live with or without God. All the rest of creation simply is. And it is sanctified.

Do you know, there are still rare people living in dens and caves of the Earth, living on stones for years at a time-- all in pursuit of God. That is their only goal in life. Meeting a person like that might appeal to you since it is a very different way to be part of the mystical body of Christ.

[elmerfude]

I am seeking a way to get beneath and beyond the human/nature duality because it can be a real obstacle to finding the sacred essence or god if you will. The shamans were expert at this. I could never be a practicing shaman for a number of reasons but I have talked to a few of them. So my theory of the passion is that Jesus was of course in the Jewish tradition but was also a shaman. So by going through the death/resurrection cycle either literally or metaphorically, he was a dramatic statement that he and therefore we are nature and that we only survive death and are reborn by recapitulation of the death/rebirth cycle that is nature. He was a symbol for all the cycles that science has found at the astronomical, geologic and biologic levels. This leads me to the concept of the sacred impulse in nature wherein as we and everything else in nature go through the death/rebirth cycle our intelligence and sentience is added to the universe--something akin to Jung's collective unconscious except more general. There is therefore a direction in evolution sort of like that intuited by Teilhard. So science has done a terrific job at elucidating the relations between matter/energy but we will never have a complete understanding of the nature of nature until spirit is added into the equation as part of the Trinity: matter, energy, spirit.

[minimalist syntax]

I think you would find some things that you intensely disliked in Orthodoxy and other things you would really love (in any case, stay away from fundamentalist Orthodox-- they exist too unfortunately). A holy person told me we should live all of life as a liturgy. For each of us to be priests. The Orthodox liturgy is even more liturgical than the Catholic liturgy. I love it. There are liturgies that are preceded by all night vigils. You would almost certainly have to go to a monastery to experience this kind of liturgy. The Orthodox Church does not have spires that reach to heaven. It has a dome that represents our cosmology. The Dome is filled with an icon of Christ: it is a particular icon called Christ the Almighty. It represents Christ in a moment of absolute spiritual power. There are sometimes also stars painted in the dome. There are always chandeliers, that stand for the sun and the stars. There is a point in this all night vigil + liturgy where they actually make the chandeliers move in a kind of dance (that is, the chandeliers dance). I would love to read your ideas about the liturgy of worship you have developed.

[elmerfude]

My liturgy is simple and occurs usually outdoors alone. (My religion isn't popular.) I try to utilize all four of the realms of human knowing: logos, mythos, eros, pathos. For logos I recite and contemplate a scientific principle, equation or formula. This also involves a prayer of gratitude to trees for providing oxygen, shade, bird houses, nuts, fruit, etc. (This week it was the carbon cycle.) For mythos I might recite a poem from the Bible or a part of Ovid's Metamorphosis or read a passage of a novel or poem that has mythological implications or even a passage from the likes of Anne Morrow Lindbergh or St. Exupery who found a mystic dimension via the use of the technology of flight. (Below I have attached my reading from this week.) For eros I might listen to some music or recite the Song of Songs or a poem by Pablo Neruda. I have not reached the level of Terry Tempest Williams as described in her book Desert Quartet where she has an erotic encounter with sandstone sliprock. But I try to capture some of the erotic dimension of nature like O"Keeffe did with painting only I use photography. For pathos I might have a burial ceremony for a fallen sparrow or insect or even rescue spiders from the house before my wife stomps them. I also like to honor St. Frances by talking to the squirrels, goldfish or earthworms.

[elmerfude]

Susan Griffin in her book Woman and Nature provides the mythos lesson for the week:
“He says that woman speaks with nature. That she hears voices from the earth. That wind blows in her ears and trees whisper to her. That the dead sing songs through her mouth and the cries of infants are clear to her. But for him this dialogue is over. He says he is not part of this world, that he was set on this world as a stranger. He sets himself apart from woman and nature. And so it is Goldilocks who goes to the home of the three bears. Little Red Riding Hood who converses with the wolf. Dorothy who befriends a lion, Snow White who talks to the birds, Cinderella with mice as her allies, the Mermaid who is half fish, Thumbelina courted by a mole. (And when we hear in the Navaho chant of the mountain that a grown man sits and smokes with bears and follows directions given to him by squirrels, we are surprised. We had thought that only little girls spoke with animals.)”

[minimalist syntax]

Part 1:
@Hirnlego I am going to move the discussion up here because the thread has gotten too narrow to respond to . (also -- what is your avatar name from: Gehirn???)
You assert: "God does indeed seem to demand [belief], at least "no other gods before me" sort of thing. So he seems to be aware that there are other gods (at least know that humans believe in other deities) and is - jealous! I've said it many times before but I'll say it again. He is way too human-like. To be jealous for a deity is very petty...I certainly expect more."

The "no other gods before me" is a commandment to God's own people. The ones who already believe, or at least declare they believe. A large portion of the Old Testament is a battle between the One True Universal God and all the false gods.

[minimalist syntax]

part 2--
And it is told in the contemporary genres of those times. Sometimes the One True Universal God has to take the battle directly to the people as he does when he asks Abraham to sacrifice his own son, as the false gods commonly did (practice human sacrifice), than at the last minute, the One True Universal God stops Abraham from sacrificing his son-- he does not desire human sacrifice like the other, false gods did. Instead, the One True Universal God will himself offer his own son as sacrifice to the world: and just as Isaac carried the wood for what was to be his own sacrifice, Jesus carried the wood for his own sacrifice. At other times, the gods just battle between themselves as they do when the world must end by flood or in Egypt where the One True Universal God has to battle the false gods through his prophet Moses and then the first born of the non-believing world must end. But the people of that time understood the genres and recognized this is not history but rather anti-history. The stories have to start with destruction so the new king (the One True Universal God in this case) can be the author of the new story. These are genres, *not* attributes of God.

[elmerfude]

I really like the idea that "these are genres." Are you familiar with the theory of literature described in An Anatomy of Literature by Foulke and Smith? I got this in a mythology course I took. It really helped me understand mythology through the genres of narrative romance, narrative tragedy, narrative comedy, narrative irony. These are like literary archetypes that are found over and over again in great literature including of course some of the Bible stories.

[minimalist syntax]

I haven't heard about the theory of literature that you talk about here. It would be intriguing to study this kind of thing.

[timezone]

I'm thankful for the debate this series has sparked. Whether one agrees or disagrees, it's a very interesting topic that I enjoy learning more about.

[MosheDayanHero]

Nan-in, a Japanese master during the Meiji era (1868-1912), received a university professor who came to inquire about Zen.

Nan-in served tea. He poured his visitor's cup full, and then kept on pouring.

The professor watched the overflow until he no longer could restrain himself. "It is overfull. No more will go in!"

"Like this cup," Nan-in said, "you are full of your own opinions and speculations. How can I show you Zen unless you first empty your cup?"

[JohnFromCensornati]

"of the three streams, it is the most concerned with influencing the life we are leading here on Earth: protecting us from harm and giving us the keys to worldly success."

I have a lucky penny that does the same thing and I can't explain how it works either without using an "untranslatable word". Of course, like mystical theology, it doesn't work any more consistently than my four leaf clover, but it's really shiny!

[kwinter]

I couldn't have said it better myself!
;)

[JohnFromCensornati]

Hat tip to kwinter. This came right through the oneness of the universe to me.

[wondering]

Isn't it interesting that there are three "streams" and four "definitions" (see part I) of kabbalah?

True Believers are famous for "moving the goalposts" - when you point out some inconsistency or falsehood or unfortunate example of hate in their belief system, they quickly say, "Oh no, it doesn't mean A, it's really B."

Kabbalah seems to be trying to head off that problem by setting up multiple goalposts before the discussion even begins.

Also, I got a kick out of the author describing the first two "streams", and then calling the third stream "magical" - as if the other two were grounded in reality.
.

[JohnFromCensornati]

Right, "the most popular forms of Kabbalah today make heavy use of magic"!?
Isn't magic fakery? Then again, god is everything.

[minimalist syntax]

wondering, isn't the definition of magic that it is attempting to control the outcome of physical events? The first two streams are not interested in that kind of thing, but the last one is. (also, I still really want to know why it matters for Fibonacci sequence that there is an initial delay in the process? I am asking sincerely)

[MosheDayanHero]

Spirituali­ty/Religio­n has four components that are meaningful-- mythology, morality, mysticism and meditation/prayer
1.Cultural mythology is of vital importance. Read Jung "Symbols of Transforma­tion."
2.Set of moral pronouncements are important to prevent various societies from disintegrating into chaos. The appeals to Higher Source ( while disingenuous) often help to control the mob. This was the case in ALL societies including atheist ( Soviet Union, China).
3. Mysticism--- awe before Universe, understanding that all things are interconnected, and intense exploration of one's inner world. This is perhaps the most important aspect of religious thought that is vital. Leading to #4.
4.Meditati­on/prayer-­- extremely useful tool for understanding the inner and outer world. Enabled some to achieve subtle understanding of the Universe that took science centuries to catch up.
Now, certainly most that passes for spirituality in various churches, temples and mosques is hopeless ( and dangerous) nonsense. A. Huxley refereed to this as "idolatrous worship of the word."
But no one can dismiss Sufi, Taoists, Zen, Ch'an and. Hassids.

[elmerfude]

Outstanding! At last some worthy discussion on the blogosphere. Your post almost makes all the abuse found out here tolerable. A diamond in the rough.

[Hirnlego]

"The man who invented the telescope found out more about heaven than the closed eyes of prayer ever discovered­."
-- Robert G. Ingersoll, "The Great Agnostic" (1833-1899)

[elmerfude]

I can get down with that. Recently I saw a picture of a mathematical simulation of the expanding galaxy. Next to it was a picture of a thin section of a mouse neuron. They looked exactly the same. What do you make of that? This is not a trick question. I would like your opinion.

[MosheDayanHero]

Hirnlego, you're arguing from the point of passing aquintance with what conventionally is called science combined with total unfamilairity about advances made by Eastern and Western introspective mystics.

"Modern physics then, pictures matter not at all as passive and inert, but being in a continuous dancing and vibrating motion whose rhythmic patterns are determined by the molecular, atomic and nuclear structures.
This is also the way in which the Eastern mystics see the material world. They all emphasize that the universe has to be grasped dynamically, as it moves, vibrates and dances; that nature is not a static but dynamic equilibriu­m."
(Fritjof Capra, The Tao of Physics, P216)

Note that some of extremely sophisticated Eastern mystical understanding of Universe predates Western knowledge thereof by many hundreds of years.

[KatrinaAriel]

There are so many parallels here with the non-dualistic Tantric philosophy that informs the yoga I practice and teach. The one becomes the many to play the game of concealment and revelation, and to creatively express in myriad forms. Yet as individual sparks of the one, we are drawn into our hearts through many paths to remember our innate connection.

Thank you for this series of articles. It's lovely to learn about this thread of light in the divine tapestry.

[mergina]

just look in a mirror...o­r hold a leaf up to the sun...or..­..........­.....!

[truthartbeauty]

god exists only in the imaginations of people, no where else

[Diogenis]

keep repeating that and you will believe it. Nuf said.

[wondering]

Wow, what a comeback.

If you think god(s) are not figments of the imagination, please provide evidence. (You might want to read up on rebuttals to the teleological, cosmological, and ontological proofs before you try - whatever YOUR evidence or proof of god, it may have already been debunked.)

This should be interesting.
.

[elmerfude]

And you know this how? Prove it!

[jnutlfam2]

I'm glad you said that. Had someone expressed the idea "God exists" I'm sure "truthartbeauty" would have said "prove it".

[wondering]

(This feels like deja vu)

When a fantastical claim is made, the burden of proof is always on the claimant.

Millions of, otherwise sane, human beings believe that a fat man in red breaks into their homes each Dec. 25, and leaves toys behind. Do you? If not, maybe I should demand that you PROVE that Santa doesn't exist. (Granted, most Santa-believers are under the age of 10, but at least they have the empirical evidence of presents under the tree.)

Now when atheists employ this God/Santa analogy, True Believers often react with indignation : "How can you compare the two? One is Gawd, the other is a fiction!" Okay ... why is a god more believable than any other fiction? Do the NUMBER of god-believers PROVE that a god must existence? Do any holy books reveal their special nature? Or maybe it's because god-belief fills so many holes - fear, loneliness, a lack of understanding - that we NEED it or else we would run shrieking in the streets.

You tell me.
.

[Hirnlego]

Believing means I'm unsure. If something is true, then either I know it or I don't know it. Therefore, I don't need to believe in anything.
--Ignots Pistachio

Why are there arguments for God's existence? People don't argue over things they know exist. An argument for God is simply a hidden admission that he or she doesn't know. The very fact that there is an argument at all is evidence for agnosticism and doubt.
--Ignots Pistachio

[jnutlfam2]

Interestin­g..but what if you're wrong?

We are so quick to denounce even the idea of the existence of God because "man" wrote the bible, yet we forget about the inspiration that those men wrote under.

Actually, though does God really have to prove His existence to us? I mean....re­ally? He is God after all.

[wondering]

Okay ... what then is the ultimate source of god-belief?

Almost certainly, you were made aware of the concept of god(s) by your parents or others in your childhood. This either took the form of indoctrination (and indoctrination can be subtle when it comes to children), or you found that the god-concept filled scary holes in your understanding (what happens when we die? how did the world begin?), or you found the idea of a cosmic Mafia-don comforting. Later, you molded your observations of phenomena to match your pre-conceived god-belief.

But none of that is proof. It's a convenient fiction that makes it easier to face the every-day without having to use your mind. In what way have I not described a fiction?

Two of your comments are interesting :

You asked "...but what if you're wrong?" Are you seriously proposing Pascal's wager? Should I believe in your angry petulant god just because I don't want to find out what She will do to me? If such a god existed, it would be the duty of every one of us to reject Her.

Then you ask, "... does God really have to prove His existence to us? I mean....re­ally? He is God after all." This had me in stitches. If I don't already believe in Her, why would this argument matter to me? And, much worse, your reasoning is circular - god is important because god is god. Huh?
.

[wm1066]

If you look at the Sisteen Chapel Michelangelo might have been subtely saying this with his picture of God extending his hand to Man. If you notice God is on what could be interpreted as a representation of a halved brain, thus the idea that God is in the mind of Man. This is not my idea, but after looking at the image its an interesting idea.

[elmerfude]

I just viewed a show of Michelangelo's preparatory drawings for the Chapel ceiling at the Seattle Art Museum. They are full of homoerotic images. He was also literally giving the Pope the finger. See the book The Sistine Secrets by Benjamin Blech. Of course this does not take away from the astonishing imagery in the work. Of course god is in the mind of man and everywhere else.

[mergina]

Every spiritual master that ever visited this planet never called themselves god, they were simply perceived as such. If an advanced being arrived here, today, oh so many would look upon that being as a god. Small wonder it made the 'god' impression on our more primitive ancestors.

[wondering]

I get it ...

The more you add to a house of cards, the closer it comes to being a real house.

Youch.
.

[JohnFromCensornati]

Hey wondering.
I loved this part: "Once its illusory self is seen to be nothing but illusion, the world is experienced as nothing but the Divine Light"

We're just entertainment for this ein sof thingy! Pain & suffering are just Divine Light!

[elmerfude]

I am not prepared to toss out centuries of accumulated religious wisdom any more than I am prepared to throw out science because its paradigms change. I understood this better when I delved into the mythology of shamanism as part of a class I took. It was fascinating how shamanic imagery underlies Christian mythology not to mention primitive and even modern art. Art often anticipates the findings of science.

[wondering]

Paradigms change in science because THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO. Unlike religion, science does not arrive complete and perfect - science is a process. Scientific knowledge is the accumulated findings that are generally accepted at the present, but they are not written in stone (nor on stone tablets).

In fact, it is faith that is subjective, immutable, and irrational. Subjective because it is whatever we want it to be (and it cannot truly be shared - anymore than you can share a dream). Immutable because it cannot admit to being wrong (the best that a True Believer can acheive when they find their particular brand of faith wanting, is to replace it with another equally subjective, immutable, irrational faith.) And irrational for obvious reasons.

What exactly is "accumulated religious wisdom"? Commentary on past fiction?
.

[singermuse]

To me, God does exist. He/She/It is a very important part of my life. As the saying goes:
For the one with faith, no explanation is necessary, for the one without faith, no explanation is possible.
But I reserve the right to respect all people their right to believe or not to believe. I daily find it wonderful and amazing that I can strive to see God in everybody, even in Atheists!

[Mystic01]

Excellent! Fanned.

[jnutlfam2]

According to the bible, all mankind have been given a measure of faith, some use it to believe, I guess others to disbelieve. I recall that Jesus asked something along the lines that when He returned would He even find faith on the earth. Interesting observation there.

[JohnFromCensornati]

According to the bible, all gay people are really just straight people who "sin". It's a book of nonsense.

[minimalist syntax]

I appreciated reading your thoughts about this.

[JohnFromCensornati]

This gets better every week!
It's a little bit fundy, a little bit apophatic, a little bit voodoo, and a little bit SIMS!

[minimalist syntax]

I like the apophatic part.

[Mystic01]

So do I.

[elmerfude]

I do also minimalist. Why are it the atheists on this thread not as nasty as usual? Just curious.

[elmerfude]

Sorry about the mangled grammar in my last message.

[MosheDayanHero]

The truth is there's no evidence to prove it.
The rest is just verbal gymnastics.

[Redwood Eagle]

Name something about theology that CAN be proven.

EVERY religion, and every aspect of every religion, is just made up stuff anyway. But some people find religion to be a helpful thing -- it betters their lives in some way, or at least they feel like it does. I'm in favor of things that make people feel good so long as they harm no one else.

[elmerfude]

All evidence is fleeting and all truth is temporary.

[minimalist syntax]

If what you just said is true, might that be a paradox?

[Mystic01]

To a certain extent all religious talk is verbal gymnastics, or, if you like, semantics. I say this as a devout Christian, by the way, who once heavily got into these verbal gymnastics then realized how futile it all was. What I learned is that you have to leave the semantics behind and get to the truth behind and beyond the words--the apophatic stuff, as a couple comments above refer to it. That leads to silence, which I find so much better than the semantics.

[MosheDayanHero]

Once you find silence you leave organized religion far behind.

[JohnFromCensornati]

I do like to talk about what it isn't.