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I Agree With the People Who Yelled "Yes," We Should Let Him Die at the Debate

Posted: 09/15/11 11:00 AM ET

There's a lot of controversy over a question asked to Ron Paul at the Tea Party debate and the response yelled by a handful of audience members. Here it is....

BLITZER: ...A healthy 30-year-old young man has a good job, makes a good living, but decides, you know what? I'm not going to spend $200 or $300 a month for health insurance because I'm healthy, I don't need it. But something terrible happens, all of a sudden he needs it.

Who's going to pay if he goes into a coma, for example? Who pays for that?

PAUL: Well, in a society that you accept welfarism and socialism, he expects the government to take care of him.

BLITZER: Well, what do you want?

PAUL: But what he should do is whatever he wants to do, and assume responsibility for himself. My advice to him would have a major medical policy, but not be forced --

BLITZER: But he doesn't have that. He doesn't have it, and he needs intensive care for six months. Who pays?

PAUL: That's what freedom is all about, taking your own risks. This whole idea that you have to prepare and take care of everybody --

(APPLAUSE)

BLITZER: But Congressman, are you saying that society should just let him die? (Handful of people in the audience: YES!)

PAUL: No....

First of all, as per usual when dealing with the Left, the actual question here is regularly being taken out of context. In Blitzer's question, he wasn't referring to someone who couldn't afford insurance. He was talking about someone who had the money and just decided to spend it elsewhere.

One of the dirty little secrets of health care in this country is that a lot of the people who don't buy insurance can afford it, but choose not to do so. For example, if you're one of the 10 million illegal aliens in this country, why would you pay for insurance? You're going to get free care when you go to the emergency room anyway and you won't ever have to pay your bills since you're here under an assumed identity. Then there are young Americans. A lot of them are willing to roll the dice, forget about insurance, and hope they don't get seriously ill. If we're perfectly honest, we should admit that MOST OF THEM will win that bet. Should they buy insurance anyway? Yes, it's the smart thing to do because even though they PROBABLY won't become seriously ill, the downside risk is so extreme that if they come up snake-eyes, they could pile up more debt than they could pay off in a decade or two.

What we should recognize, however, is that this is a health care problem we have largely created for ourselves. If we tell people, "Whether you buy health insurance or whether you don't, we'll still treat you and then, if you get too far in over your head with the bills, we'll let you declare bankruptcy" -- well then, millions of people will do just that. Because we start with that ludicrous proposition as a given, we've gotten into a place where so many people feel like they have to run the Constitution through a shredder in order to force people to buy health insurance as a condition of citizenship.

Here's an alternate idea: How about we give out tax credits that allow every American to buy health insurance if they want it and if they choose NOT to do so, then we let them suffer the consequences? Some people would make the "wrong" decision and then they'd get ill and be unable to afford treatment. At some point, churches, foundations, or wealthy Americans would probably step in to provide clinics to try to give those people SOME help, but there would be people who fall through the cracks. That's the downside of having a truly free society. However, the alternative of having an all-powerful government that tries to control every aspect of our lives to make sure we all "do the right thing" is much worse.

Instead, why not let people take more responsibility for their own lives, allow more people to choose their own health insurance, watch as the cost of care drops, and as a bonus, we wouldn't have to throw the Constitution out the window.

 

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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
stryker
06:44 AM on 09/17/2011
The author says allow more people to buy their own health insurance and the cost will drop. Everyone now is allowed to buy insurance. There is not one person who us barred from buying insurance, so where does he get that idea? Isn't that what the mandate is all about, making more people buy insurance, even the lowest valued? Also, when has any carrier lowered its costs? When carriers cut cost of premiums, they make up for that with higher deductible and copays and less coverage. Some years back my wife spent a month in hospital fighting leukemia. The hospital bill itself was over $100K. Luckily, I had good coverage. If I had chosen not to have coverage, what church or charity would have covered those bills? I am surprised that the repubs are not pushing the mandate as it falls right up their alley of "personal responsibility." Why should someone else pay for your bills? Grayson was right: the repub health plan was don't get sick or just die.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
MadamDeb
08:31 PM on 09/16/2011
Hmm, pretty good argument for the Individual Mandate, there, John.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Michael Welch
07:52 PM on 09/16/2011
If we are truly going to have a free society, let's get the corporations off the public dole as well as those darn health care cheats who seem to be so prevalent in the debates. Figure out a flat tax rate that EVERYONE, individuals or corporations, should pay to make our minimalist government work. No more loopholes, no more government subsidies to businesses.. everybody pays X percentage. Of course we'll have to deal with the flood of unemployed tax accountants, but hey.. they should have seen this coming.
12:56 PM on 09/16/2011
200 to 300 dollars a month for insurance? Now there's a fantasy. Try doubling that at the very least and hope you don't have any tiny little thing wrong with you that will get you rejected from any insurer.
11:25 AM on 09/16/2011
If the words "should/shouldn't" didn't exist conservatives and libertarians couldn't say anything.

Why is the discussion about a mythical man who could have afforded health insurance when in the real world millions of American families cannot?

Back in the '90s I was forced into early retirement by so-called corporate downsizing. My package included 50% payment of medical insurance. By the time I turned 60 my HALF of the insurance was $1200/month....actually exceeding my pension. So for years we lived with a gun at our head. If we had had a major problem, even if the emergency room tended it, we would have lost our house, etc.

And the emergency room myth! Anyone who has ever had to go to the hospital for a real emegency knows that the first thing they ask you is for your insurance card. If you cannot produce one they push you off into another room and after they have taken care of those who produced cards and if you are still alive they will tend to you. I have had it happen to me when I had super insurance and just didn't realize I had to carry the card. I had an auto accident head injury, they gave me a rag to hold on the bleeding, and I lay in wait for hours until the welfare doctor came and stitched me up. I have known people to die waiting for ER attention.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Michael Welch
09:53 AM on 09/16/2011
Yes, people should be personally responsible for their health care costs. So I agree in principle. But who protects them from insurance companies that make bad business decisions and go bankrupt? Who protects them from employers who provide health insurance as a benefit, but when the employee goes in for treatment, they find the employer hasn't actually paid those insurance premiums? Who protects employees from losing their jobs, and their ability to pay for insurance, because Wall Street bankers got greedy and sent our entire economy down the tubes? Good, honest, hard working people can make their best business decisions, but still get shafted by things beyond their control. The buck for all those bad situations will still land squarely on our government's doorstep, because I don't see private industry stepping up to address those concerns. Until they do, all this talk of personal responsibility is just empty sound bites.
08:39 AM on 09/16/2011
"Pro blogger"? HA! Good one!
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Amin Khad
01:17 AM on 09/16/2011
"At some point, churches, foundations, or wealthy Americans would probably step in to provide clinics to try to give those people SOME help, but there would be people who fall through the cracks. That's the downside of having a truly free society."

Thank you, exactly.

The refusal to look at this rationally is destroying Western economies.
11:47 PM on 09/15/2011
I think this is absurd. There are probably millions of people who would be reckless, careless, or ignorant enough under your proposed "let them die" system to "fall through the cracks," as you put it (and die, I assume).

Human beings are simply NOT perfectly rational robots as libertarians would like to imagine. People carelessly forget to pay their insurance bills. Studies have shown that younger people are simply less risk-averse & and more reckless than older people, and this of course affects whether they feel they need to buy health insurance. And tons of people are not financially literate or able to make sound business decisions.

Your basic point is that these people deserve to die — just for having poor judgment. It's an insane, cruel concept and no other developed country operates this way.

If we really want to compete with other countries in the global marketplace, we could lessen the burden paid by companies for hiring US citizens if the government provided basic health care — just like every other developed nation.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Amin Khad
01:17 AM on 09/16/2011
They're adults, they make their own choices. Your ideology rationalizes the war on drugs and every other government over-reach.
08:23 AM on 09/16/2011
I think the question is pretty absurd and extreme. Because as Ron Paul mentioned these people would get taken care of regardless. I don't agree with the people who shouted Yes and I consider myself a Libertarian. Part of my identity is respect for life, something that I strongly share with Ron Paul and in a truly free society where doctors and nurses really care about their patients it'd be an epic failure for such a scenario to happen.
01:00 PM on 09/16/2011
The entire basis of libertarianism is that people make and pay for their own mistakes without the help of society. Who exactly do you think pays when a doctor or nurse 'really care about their patient' - the doctors and nurses? No society does and in order to do so without major holes and frankly, in any kind of efficient way - it has to be at the expense of the entire society without regard to each citizen's wishes - in other words taxes.

If you don't agree and recognize the reality of this position, you really aren't a libertarian, you are just a dreamer that assumes that the safety net was maintained by magic.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
dbrett480
10:30 PM on 09/15/2011
The issue isn't with the choice of whether to buy insurance or not, it's with the affordability of health insurance. Just look at the huge increases in the cost of insurance and you will see why many people go without health insurance.
10:24 PM on 09/15/2011
First of all, thanks for this article and AMEN.

I can't believe libertarian ideas are actually drawing this much ire. It's just insane. We don't want more freedom. We want more government! Really?

Isn't the real problem that health care costs so F-ing much? Why don't we try fixing that before we hand it over the government. They've done such a bang up job with everything else.
03:44 PM on 09/15/2011
Some good ideas.
Government created healthcare has had the unintended consequence of jacking up healthcare prices to the point that it is un-affordable if you are on your own.
The cost for having a baby in 1950 was around $86. Adjusted for inflation that is $755.00
I was on Medicare when I had mine, it $7000. If they raise the cost of healthcare, the gov. will just pay for it. They have created a monster that is going to be difficult to get back in control of.
I do like your idea of tax credits as an incentive to purchase health insurance. That would be a step in the right direction.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Michael Welch
09:35 AM on 09/16/2011
Why did you have a baby on Medicare??? Weren't you prepared for your pregnancy with your own funds or your own private health insurance? Seems like you are beating on the government system that was your safety net at the time you had your baby.
12:39 PM on 09/17/2011
Honestly, We were unprepared. I found out that I was pregnant (accident) 2 days after my husband was out of the navy, we weren't even to our new home state yet. Tricare had just been cut off, and his new job wasn't paying enough for insurance, I was told that I was "un-hireable " because we moved too much (military mandated moves, it doesn't matter to employers though). We could have foot a bill for $1000 had Medicare never happened and if healthcare hadn't skyrocketed as a result, but $7000? It has caused far more problems than it has solved. Had it not served to jack the price of healthcare up, we wouldn't have had to use it. It is a compounding problem that needs to be addressed and fixed.
jhNY
Mercy.
02:31 PM on 09/15/2011
We need health care for everyone, not health insurance. Every developed nation has a better, and usually state-run system in place, than we have, though our present way of doing things makes the costs of health care twice what those other nations pay.
08:28 AM on 09/16/2011
It's mostly because the government is in bed with drug corporations etc that the costs are so high compared to other nations. Even so, socialist leaning nations have a tendency to fail. I think this is what we are seeing in Europe right now. There could be one epic collapse coming.
09:51 AM on 09/16/2011
We're seeing "socialist leaning" nations struggling in Europe largely because this capitalist leaning nation reamed the world economy.
jhNY
Mercy.
02:24 PM on 09/15/2011
This kind of genius should hide its light under a bushel.
11:51 AM on 09/15/2011
I have to agree with John and the Tea Party animals. That's just what Jesus would do.
Lord have Mercy on us all.....