Jamey Rodemeyer is a 14-year-old kid from Buffalo, N.Y., who earlier this week, after years of being bullied for being gay, committed suicide.
If you're a Christian who believes that being gay is a morally reprehensible offense against God, then you share a mindset, worldview and moral structure with the kids who hounded Jamey Rodemeyer, literally, to death. It is your ethos, your convictions and your theology that informed, supported and encouraged their cruelty.
We Christians who believe that God created gay people as much in His own image as he did straight people are begging you to reconsider your theology -- to do nothing more than be open to an alternative, fully credible, scholastically sound interpretation of one or two lines from Paul.
How can you be unwilling to do something so simple, when you see the horrible ultimate cost of that refusal?
Christ died so that you could love more. And now you're part of a system that allows that same Christ to be used as a moral justification for the most vile kind of abuse. How could that have happened? How could something so right have gone so wrong?
Turn, friend. And when you do, open your arms. Discover waiting to embrace you a new Christ behind the relative shell of the one you inherited. Jesus Christ died for your sins. That was unthinkably beautiful. Now Jamey Rodemeyer has died from your sins. That is not. That is the very hell that, awfully enough, you've somehow tricked yourself into believing your life refutes.
Follow John Shore on Twitter: www.twitter.com/johnshore
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“Balancement
Commented 13 minutes ago in Religion
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“Dontcha thing yall should go take a long stroll off a short pier?”
Anyone else seeing the disconnect here?
And y'all wonder why I'll never be Christian.
Semper fi
I ask you however to please, dont stop there. Become an advocate for gay rights and marriage.
Be an ally. Get involved in support groups.
Teach your bretheren what you have learned.
Let's not let any more parents have to bury thier gay children ever again.
Kids (and adults for that matter) don't bully others about being gay because of what the church says. Under all our pretensions, and complexities, we are sexual creatures. The instinct to procreate is vital to any species, human beings included. Sure sex is fun, but bottom line - our instincts drive us to have sex to reproduce. This isn't christian doctrine - it's straight up evolutionary fact.
And since the homosexual lifestyle does not lead to procreation, it's only natural that human beings would shun the practice and ridicule it. Is it right to do so? No, of course not. But the bully at school that calls the gay (or suspected gay) student mean names is not doing so because he learned it in church. He is probably reacting to his instincts, along with a narrow world-view.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-shore/christians-and-jamey-rodemeyer_b_975603.html?ref=christianity#
During my lifetime I've been to LOTS of churches, and despite popular opinion, most of the pastors & parishioners don't sit around and preach or talk about homosexuality. Yes it is brought up from time to time, but they are not spending most Sundays sicking the hounds of heaven on homosexuals.
My point is that rather than single out the church or Christianity for demeaning gays, people need to acknowledge that there is an evolutionary reason that homosexuality is frowned upon by many people.
The scientists who have actually studied homosexuality in the natural world have been astounded to learn that homosexuality can be found in at least 1,500 species of animals, ranging all the way from lowly bedbugs up to primates. In at least 2 species of birds scientists have discovered how homosexuality actually contributes to the overall viability of the species. They found that in some cases there will be a "mommie," a "daddie," and an "uncle." In these triads the offspring had greater success rates in living to adulthood because of increased food and protection. Thus, evolution favored these homosexual bonds. The "homosexual lifestyle" as you call it appears to contribute to the overall survivability of the species even though it does not contribute directly to procreation.
As such it's only natural that people would notice it, single it out and sometimes attack it. Again, I'm not saying it is right; I am saying that there are a heck of a lot of other reasons that people have an aversion to homosexuality than simply churches.
Homosexuality, in addition to being singled out by christianity, is also singled out by islam, goes against traditional societal norms and probably a lot of other things that could be listed.
I am not attacking homosexuality, simply offering an alternative to the things that should be attacked. Going after christians for this is like shooting fish in a bucket, and won't make a dent on hatred.
Me? I could care less. I am fatigued by all the talk on news sites and in general about peoples' sexuality. People can do what they want. Neither I, or any earthbound human or institution holds the keys to heaven to keep anyone out.
But there are more things to be attacked than simply churches, most of which don't spend a heck of a lot of time or energy worrying about homosexuality. At least they didn't until it became a subject that is constantly hashed over in the mainstream media.
An honest appraisal of humanity will tell anyone that this is true. However, there are no powerful groups of people representing the fat kids or the smart kids, or the small kids, etc..., so we don't hear it every day in the news.
Fact: Most people are average (redundant, I know, but true), the average (majority of people) will almost always lash out at the below average and above average. Now I'm not here to call homosexuality either below or above average, just calling a spade a spade and stating that it deviates from the norm (average folks) thus they will take note of it and probably lash out at it.
My screen name is a video game screen name, not anything with a political agenda, so you reading too much into it is out of place...:>
Ever hear of original sin? Traditional Christian view of us is that we are born sinful, and need to be redeemed, that none of us are fit for salvation based on our own merits. So being "born that way" says absolutely nothing, or at least, nothing favorable, about homosexuality, from a Christian perspective.
Not to mention, pedophiles and sociopaths may also be "born that way." Which I note not to equate these with homosexuals, but merely point out that the "born that way" argument is a dangerous one to make, as it covers a lot of things that are very hard to defend.
But the Bible DOESN'T say homosexuality is wrong, when context is fully understood. Even if it did, why won't people use the hearts and minds God blessed them with to understand that their theology has created a homophobic demon amongst us? Why can't kids like Jamey live their lives honestly, true to how God created them?
Christians need to educate themselves about what being gay really means. You need to read those passages within the cultural context in which they were written, and learn how, through translations and "updates," they have changed. How can so many religious teachers now see that being gay is no more a sin than curly hair, yet others cling to an archaic understanding of God's word that hurts people?
Just as the Bible was used to condone slavery, just as the Bible was used to "prove" that Galileo was an agent of Satan by daring to say that the earth revolves around the sun - our HUMAN understanding of Biblical texts has changed over the years as our HUMAN understanding of our world and ourselves has deepened. As God hoped we would do, I'm sure - because his son brought one great Commandment about LOVE to us. Sadly, we seem to be failing pretty
Now the child is older and realizes that he or she are different. The dirty jokes start to be not so funny. Then the young person realizes that he or she is the type of person his friends discussed in derogatory terms. Things really get worse when the so-called friends find out. The rejection causes a black depression that can lead to suicide as happened in this case. Fortunately most get past this point.
Here in Sacramento a young woman told her teacher in a "Christian??" high school she was gay. The teacher reported it and the child was expelled for being who she was.
Remember Christ sat and ate with the outcasts of Jewish society.. Francis Assisi embraced a leper. Gays and lesbians are the lepers in today's society. Could you do the same as Christ or Francis?
On a more general level, religious or social mores are blunt instruments. Often, there will always be egregious examples of harm done under them. But one cannot, for that reason, abandon having them. They are critical for the existence of all societies, religious or secular.
Now, if merely describing homosexual relations as being sinful counts as gay bashing, then yeah, they support gay bashing. But it is ridiculous to condemn them for it. Part of their job, as ministers, is to preach about sin. To a traditionalist, homosexual relations are sinful.
I also think it is a very difficult argument to make that it is un-Christian to preach what has been the standard Christian view of homosexual relations for hundreds of years. Why should you, today, be a more authoritative source on this issue than the thousands of learned theologians who came before?
Personally, I think the issue of changing Christianity to make it more "gay friendly" is really a subset of the problem we have with the idea of sin. We really don't much like the concept of sin these days, and have real problems with defining it to include any conduct that does not seem "wrong" under our current, "no harm, no foul" view of personal conduct.
But I do not support this article. As a rationalist, I see no reason why the solution to superstition and supernaturalism should be more of both, albeit a little nicer. Scientific reason is the best hope for a more just future, period.
humans are irrational, emotionally-complex naked primates with oversized brains who generally favor seeking social status more than they favor seeking objective truth. You have to talk to them like they're one.
when people go around calling you "abominations to god", "enemies of god", "gravely morally disordered with an intrinsic tendency towards grave mnoral evil"...
...a threat to family children, faith, freedom in general, the military, freedom of speech, freedom of religion, heterosexuality, national security, heterosexuality, manhood, motherhood, God, America and goddam western civilization (such as it is)...
...when they advocate, nay, DEMAND, that gay human beings be treated differently than other human beings...
...when they insist that gay sinners are a special class of isnners, not really as good as other sinners...
I think that they are in fact encouraging taunting, harassing, and bullying.
But maybe I'm overly sensitive
Tolerance does not mean you have to agree with homosexuality, it just means you leave people in peace to go about their business, in the same way that you are left alone by others to go about yours.
The problem exists in that BOTH "sides" feel that they have force the other side to agree with them. I am not a Christian, and I am very pro-gay rights, but I do not believe it is my place to make Christians accept homosexuality. I do believe it is my place to advocate to keep them from interfering in the private lives of others who have nothing to do with them.
I want them to mind their own goddamned and goddaming business, focus on their own families, be "for their own marriages, and stay the hell out of my life.
First, where do you see Christians justifying abuse? I see Christians advocating for compassion and kindness.
Second, where do you see Christians saying Christ said to hate thy neighbor? In fact it's the exact opposite, where the bible says "Love thy neighbor as thyself."
Third, where is it stated that any of the comments written to that young man were advocated by Christians, written by Christians, or supported by Christians? It couldn't be the comment advocating suicide, which directly contravenes the faith.
Fourth, Christian convictions and theology encouraged cruelty? Which conviction says cruelty is justified? Is it the one of love? Which part of the theology says cruelty is justified? Is it the one that disagrees with homosexual activity? Is it part that disagrees with sexual contact outside of marriage? Is it the one that says you should spread the word of Christ and not keep it to yourself? So, would a Christian be cruel for saying that homosexual behavior is not accepted in the faith? Would they be cruel for advocating no pre-marital sexual contact? Would they be cruel for advocating no same-sex marriage? Or is the cruelty not keeping their religious opinions to themselves?
It is over simplistic and ridiculous to lay blame for this child's death on a faith that argues against suicide and argues against hate, particularly when nothing is known about who said what or why.
But you're right. Cruelty is not of God and anyone who treated Jamey cruelly can not possibly represent Christ - at all!
The thing is, homosexuality is not something one can "agree with," or not. You can't disagree with it any more than you can disagree with someone's race or ethnicity or hair-color or handedness! You can't disagree with something that just IS, yet too many conservative Christians think they can.
And it matters, because they vote. Christians are the majority in this country, and we have civil rights are in place to protect minorities from the misguided prejudices of the majority. That's why the vote against gay marriage in CA was so wrong - it doesn't matter one bit that the supposed majority wanted to prevent our gay citizens from marrying - our gay citizens deserve the same rights as the rest of us, so if we can marry, they must be allowed to do so as well. It's actually very simple - and Christianity is the single entity that fights AGAINST civil rights for LGBT citizens.