Did Dick Cheney knowingly send intelligence officials to Congress to mislead them about the use of waterboarding? Did the Vice President himself?
We simply don't know. But we need to know, in light of the explosive report in the Washington Post today, that the Vice President took a very personal role in some Congressional briefings.
We've got a petition up demanding the truth, over at VoteVets.org.
Now, why would veterans of Iraq and Afghanistan care about this? Isn't this a political issue? Maybe, but it has far reaching implications for our troops in the field.
First - we absolutely have to send the message to the Muslim world that to the degree that we did torture, we fully investigated how those tactics came to be employed (including how it may have been hidden at the time), and held accountable those who were at fault.
To be clear, President Obama is making great progress by ending the use of torture, and moving to close the detainee facility at Guantanamo. But, it makes it harder for our troops to win hearts and minds, and still serves as a great terrorist recruiting tool, if there is word out there that the United States tortured, and let people responsible walk, without accountability.
Second - We have to send the message to our allies that when we violate international law (as General Petraeus has said), we fully investigate and hold people accountable. If we can't make good on our agreements in the Geneva Conventions, then it severely and adversely affects the trust of the world to uphold our other agreements.
Further, it hurts our ability to build coalitions in the future, when going to war is truly in our national security interests (unlike Iraq). It's always somewhat en vogue to bash the international community, but the fact of the matter is that we need the nations of the world to trust us, especially if we're to ensure that future conflicts don't fall just on the shoulders of our troops.
I see the appeal of moving ahead, and not looking back, when it comes to torture. Most people would like to just move on and forget about the past eight years. But, we can't.
The old saying from Santayana is "Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it." We can't learn from recent history unless we know everything about the recent history of torture. That's why we need to investigate the whole truth about torture, now.
Crossposted at VetVoice.com
If you go through the rest of your life trying to show people that they were wrong, you're never going to be happy because they're never going to admit it and you'll never know how they really feel. That advice was some of the best advice I ever got. You need to get in touch with your inter self Jon. How do you really feel. Come on now....telll us.
So I concur with Jon and would like to add one more thing-- holding people accountable is a part of the system of values of the rule of law for which we ask young men and women to serve in the military to preserve. We don't do it because it is convenient or fits a particular political perspective, we do it because that is what makes America great.
We can chew gum and walk at the same time.
This really does need to take place so it can never happen again. Memories are short.
I would be willing to e-mail, set up petitions and do whatever I can from home to get this on the radar. What about you?
Enjoy the cheap seats. You guys earned them.
was you cable service out?
I am so sick of "journalist" today because there really are NO journalists today. They are all just talking heads or fluff writers who seem to be afraid to ask the tough questions of Cheney.
Where did all the investigative journalist go? I'm guessing the restraints by conservative media ownership prevents them from doing any investigative work or asking the tough questions.
So, they will just sit there and let Cheney get more and more of the spot light to spew his lies. Sick.
We gloss over the known fact that Cheney's office pushed for torture so that such a specious claim could be confirmed. Since the TV series 24, I have been more inclined to believe that 911 was an inside job. The actions of Bush,Cheney et al have done nothing but increase these suspicions. Yet our beloved President, whom I still support wish to look forward while our wutless congress wants a commission that will absolve the evil doers. Maybe we should allow all felons to possess gun and regain the right to vote also. Since we want to look forward...
The lying corporate press bears full responsibility in the illegal run up to war in Iraq and needs to be harshly dealt with. A very few conservative men own ALL of the public airwaves and until this is rectified, they have the power to push propaganda and public opinion (sadly, that doesn't speak highly of a lot of this gullible nation).
A) Cheney, Pearle, Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz knew EXACTLY what they were doing as they were stupid enough to put their Empire Building aspirations on-line with the PNAC Manifesto (MOTIVE).
B) They conveniently had the NYC phone book sized "Patriot Act" Bill ready to put into action that gave the President extraordinary "Unitary Executive powers" (MEANS).
C) Like Manna from Heaven, 9/11 happened and the great wars now had purpose! (OPPORTUNITY)
A,B,C- MOTIVE, MEANS and OPPORTUNITY....
In a Court of LAW, that would make these criminals as guilty as Sin.
INVESTIGATE THESE CRIMES!
I think you and others need to keep these issues front and center for as long as it takes...just in case all of the investigations at DoJ and in Congress come off the rails, for one reason or another...and, just in case some sort of 'Truth Commision', doesn't get on the rails...and, just in case there is no accountablility at all, God forbid.
I don't understand why our MSM in this country really is not reporting the entire story on torture. There has been no mention of the torture deaths of detainees in our military prisons, nor have they covered the rape of children at Abu Ghraib. Seems to me that while they usually run the most sensational story to get positive ratings, they are either too intimidated or paid off not to cover these crimes.
There are poll numbers showing the country split on the issue of whether torture is warranted or not. I am appalled that anyone would think it was okay to use at any time. I believe that if the American people were told the "rest of the story", there would be such outrage that Washington would have no choice but to prosecute.
Please keep writing! Please keep this issue on the "front burner"!
...be a beginning. Coming clean about our history, before having our leaders making demands of others, would be ideal. Red or blue, it must be done if we are to be respected by our neighbors again.
This while America wages wars in 2 and a half (Pakistan) countries and refuses to make public its history of torture, much less be held accountable for it.
Let's forget for a minute that we have a Dem administration in DC--the ruling party is unimportant. The point here is how great the hypocrisy of our Country. How dare we attempt to hold any other nation to rules we ourselves are not prepared to follow?
Did Cheney lie to Congress? Of course. He lied about 911, anthrax, Iraq, Osama, torture, spying, and Katrina. But we expected it of him!
Before we begin making human rights demands of other countries, we must get back to holding them dear for ourselves. This administration has a chance to set the example. Prosecuting Cheney et al would
We must hold Bush & Co accountable, soon, this will do so much for the respect of our Nation as well as our people from the rest of the world.
What happens should terrorists or another country capture American soldiers and "torture" them? We can't hold them accountable or condemn them....we said torture is O.K. This puts America in a really bad place.
How can we demand that other countries follow human rights laws when it seems to be optional for America?
"I see the appeal of moving ahead, and not looking back, when it comes to torture. Most people would like to just move on and forget about the past eight years. But, we can't."
I disagree that most people would rather not look back. If criminal acts were perpetrated in my country's name, I damn well do want accountability and I think a large majority of Americans would agree with me.
Problem is, with the Washington good 'ol boy network in place, you can rest assured that there will be no investigation, much less prosecution of anyone above the rank of sergeant.
But if the ground swell of public opinion raises so high that the Obama Justice Department will be ‘Forced’ to investigate. This will remove or lessen the Political Revenge arguments.
But then again maybe Pres. Obama, whom I voted for might have some things he is going to want to keep hidden? I hope not, but. . .
The motive, as disgusting as it sounds is and always was $$$$$$$$$ !!!