Gay at Baylor: A Christian Challenge

This past October, I wrote a piece in The Huffington Post entitled "Repentance of an Anti-Gay Bigot." Among the dozens of responses I received were many from my former law students at Baylor University, where I taught for 10 years. They were heart-wrenching, revealing the pain of attending Baylor in fear of being found out and expelled because they are gay; of isolating themselves from their classmates; and ultimately their alienation from Baylor and even Christianity.

Baylor bars gays and lesbians from the faculty, and has fought hard to keep any gay student support groups from gaining recognition. It has done this in the name of Jesus Christ, claiming the authority of the Bible.

I don't teach at Baylor anymore. This week I am starting my second year as a professor of law at a Catholic school, St. Thomas, in Minneapolis. Though smaller than Baylor, it is similar in many ways. It is strong in its faith identity, and the majority of faculty (at least in my department) and students are more conservative than you would find at most other schools. Yet, there are differences, and at least one may be crucial to Baylor's future.

After a few weeks of teaching sentencing at St. Thomas, one of my students stopped by to see me right before lunch, so I invited him to join me. He had a genuine interest in criminal law, and in particular wanted to work for the U.S. Department of Justice, my former employer. I love talking about the DOJ, and asked him which division he would like to work in.

He immediately told me he wanted to work in the Civil Rights Division in Washington, an important and often controversial office. Looking over my sandwich at this middle-aged white male, I asked "Why civil rights?"

He immediately responded, "Well, I'm gay." He then began to describe some of the work he had already done in the area, but I barely knew he was talking -- After 10 years at Baylor, I was in a state of shock to hear a student openly admit this to a professor in a public place. I looked behind me to see if anyone we might know was around, and felt relieved when there were only strangers.

I need not have worried. St. Thomas has a gay and lesbian student organization, my administrative assistant is openly gay, and two of my colleagues who are full professors are also openly gay and are welcome to (and do) bring their partners to law school events. Yet, not only does the school survive, but the fact that we are welcoming to gays and lesbians does not in the least seem to be read as any kind of statement on the part of our sponsoring body, the Archdiocese of Minnesota. We are a community that includes gay men and lesbians as faculty, staff and students, and stand proudly together as Christians.

Baylor can accept gays and lesbians without sacrificing anything. Yes, the student code of conduct bars pre-marital sex, but gays and straights are equally susceptible to breaking that rule. If potential for sexual relations is a reason to bar anyone, it is a reason to bar everyone. That rule should be enforced evenly. All evidence now is that it is enforced in the dorms, but not elsewhere. If that is the case, then enforcement should be consistent, gay or straight.

Former Baylor President Abner McCall once told a good friend of mine that "Baylor can't be a Christian. Only people can be Christian." As Christian people we must be both honest and loving. Honesty tells us that there have been, are now and will be gays and lesbians at Baylor. If the plan has been to exclude them, Baylor has done a lousy job. Given that gay men and lesbians are and will be students at Baylor, love instructs us to help them grow in faith and to welcome them, rather than exclude or demean them.

The time has come for Baylor to hire gays and lesbians who meet all other requirements, to lift the veil of fear from student life, and to allow gay and lesbian groups to establish themselves on campus. Baylor is strong, proud and Christian, and all of those qualities make such a change possible without a loss of identity.

To remain an engaged and relevant institution, Baylor must change. Its message to gays and lesbians has to be something other than what is perceived on campus now: That if you are gay, there is no love for you, on Earth or in Heaven. Christ promises more, and so should Baylor.

 

 

 

Comments

[Tom Rugg]

07:34 PM on 09/13/2011

I long for the good old days when drinking a beer and that demon inspired dancing were the great sins against which Southern Baptist theology railed. Really the same problem. When you focus on the conduct instead of the person you are on the wrong path. Who was it that was criticized for hanging out with prostitutes and tax collectors? Think I'll go have a beer.

[nextppl]

07:11 PM on 09/02/2011

Thanks, Mark, for "suddenly" realizing that you committed 10 years of your post-civil rights career to an institution that systematically violates the civil rights of its students. We appreciate the sentiment, but really. Is that how it went down?

[Catothemuchyounger]

10:58 PM on 09/01/2011

The Baylor people would tell you they do show love to gays, by taking a consistent approach to homosexuality that reflects what (in their view) is right, just, and true, according to the Bible and natural law. And they would add that to soften that message even a bit to be more welcoming towards gay students would be harmful towards gays, since what gays need to focus on is that their sexual orientation is a uniquely dangerous moral hazard, because there is no morally acceptable way to act upon it.

That is not so say that is not plenty of gay bashing that goes on under the mantle of traditional morality. But it is to say that Christians who have traditional views have a fundamental problem with homosexuality, and that much criticism of them by those of less traditional Christian beliefs is in reality a criticism of their theology, not the manner in which they express it.

[arachne646]

11:40 AM on 09/02/2011

But aren't we more likely to welcome people with criminal records to Church--even seek them out--rather than have someone in the congregation that is gay and celibate, for example? There is a campus code of conduct that students are to follow, and, as far as humanly possible, they follow through, and God forgives our mistakes. There isn't one sin that keeps Christians "quarantined", a "uniquely dangerous moral hazard". Obviously, the rest of the Church must be protected from violent criminals, pickpockets and so on, but we are called to include and love everyone, and if they have sinned, then your duty is to try and save them.

[googlymoogly1]

01:31 PM on 09/02/2011

The hard part about dealing directly with your positioning is that I don't think the impetus for making changes to traditional theology is coming from folks who are gay that want to abstain in order to not sin, and therefore should be accepted as any other fallen person (all of us) is. The driving force, seems to me, to be the re-definition of homosexual activity as inherently not sinful. The explanations for how you can come to that position would be just as effective for making promiscuity (and many other things) not a sin as well....and then you're back where you started.

[Catothemuchyounger]

07:25 PM on 09/02/2011

"There isn't one sin that keeps Christians "quarantin­ed", a "uniquely dangerous moral hazard". Obviously, the rest of the Church must be protected from violent criminals, pickpocket­s and so on, but we are called to include and love everyone, and if they have sinned, then your duty is to try and save them."

To take these in turn, I think a traditionalist would say that what makes homosexuality such a moral hazard is that it has all the very powerful inducements that usually lead to heterosexual relations, not just the need for sexual expression, but also the need for love, the need for companionship, to not be alone, to share one's life. In short, all the things non-traditionalists point to as grounds for accepting it.

As to the second point, I know of no traditionalists who would disagree with the idea that one is supposed to love one's fellow man, sinner or no, and try to save them. But as I point out above, that is not enough for non-traditionalists, who believe that one cannot show love for gays without accepting their sexuality. There is no way a traditionalist can both show love for gays as fellow sinners, and promote a traditional view of homosexual relations as disordered and sinful, in a manner satisfactory to the non-traditionalists, who will say that you can't do both.

[googlymoogly1]

01:32 PM on 09/02/2011

Excellent post. Catothe..I wished I'd worded my post like yours. Yes, There's a rub for traditionalists, especially traditionalists who are not subverted by a worldly political affiliation. I don't want people to feel guilt or shame, nor do I want to be the cause of it. On the other hand I don't want to make my beliefs universally submissive to humans feelings. Just b/c something I believe makes you feel bad doesn't mean it's wrong or that I should not believe it (I'm oversimplifying obviously). In short, How do I sync my theology with certain activities w/o automatically subjecting it to the same logic in all activities

[arachne646]

04:15 PM on 09/04/2011

Both of you are responding sincerely, but neither of you can tell me (apart from funding questions) what grounds there are for discouraging young people who want to attend Baylor specifically, as a University with a code of conduct that prohibits premarital sexual activity, if they are attracted to people of the same gender as themselves. These young people are not coming to Baylor from the High School my son attended, in an urban, west coast city, which had a gay/straight alliance club. They are 17, from the same demographics as the rest of the freshman class, and they know nothing about what to say to a prayer partner who confesses that she is worried because she dreams about her best friend who lives back home pleasedon'ttellanyone. It's not Christian to keep this whole area in deep, dark secret because gay sin is worse than any other kind of sin. Secrecy does not do any good. Professor Osler has suggested no change to any Southern Baptist theology or written Baylor policy; in fact, Baylor University­'s Statement on Human Sexuality reads:
"Baylor University welcomes all students into a safe and supportive environmen­t in which to discuss and learn about a variety of issues, including those of human sexuality."
On what grounds has Baylor University repeatedly refused the Sexuality Identity Forum discussion group permission to meet? How would this not be the Christian thing to do?

[googlymoogly1]

01:24 PM on 09/01/2011

I'm a Baylor alum and have spent a lot of my life making decisions that didn't go with the flow. I didn't drink, didn't sleep with people, didn't do drugs. Lot's really backward awful things like that. Society wasn't necessarily supportive of those decisions. I was backward, close-minded, narrow, un-realistic. After going through all of that I found a college where there were other people who could have a great time without getting loaded, date w/o having to be seen as weird if you weren't sleeping together, and thought that there were more important things in life than the rat race (we called it God). Now, people come along and start pointing fingers and telling me that my school is narrow, un-realistic, and backward because we won't do what everyone else is doing....I felt this before and I'm inclined to have the same reaction...to stick with my guns.

I stuggle with how I feel about how Christians should view homosexuality. However, There has to be room for people who won't fall in line with over-arching cultural imperatives. Cultural norms are not headed my direction: homosexuality will be fully accepted at some point, Abortion will be totally socially normal, and any kind of abstinence will be seen as some sort of stunted weirdness. I just hope there's room left for people who don't have their moral agenda set by the "everyone else is doing it" mentality.

[TXanimal]

04:26 PM on 09/01/2011

Homosexuality and morals are not mutually exclusive. Homosexuality just "is". Acceptance of that fact is not a testament to the "everyone else is doing it" mentality, as homosexuality is not a choice, but an immutable trait.

[googlymoogly1]

10:04 AM on 09/02/2011

Homosexual­ity and morals are not mutually exclusive (I agree). Homosexual­ity just "is" (I agree). Acceptance of that fact is not a testament to the "everyone else is doing it" mentality (You're missing my point), as homosexual­ity is not a choice, but an immutable trait (I agree, in some cases).

Let me make a couple of one sentence statements of my own: Morality and Sin are not the same thing, from a Christian perspective anyway. Whether Homosexuality just "is" has no bearing on whether or not it is a Sin. Morality is a contract between men it has very little to do with spirit. Sin, to me, is that which we choose that takes our eyes off God. As an aside, I have been taught that Homosexuality is a sin and there are significant bible passages, and a lot of history, that support that. However, I'm considering the position and am listening to what my brothers and sisters who are gay have to say about it (or reading it on the internet anyway). The "we're born this way" argument is not a strong one for those of us that believe that man is fallen. Addressing the scriptural and historical underpinnings are stronger but, to me, still feel like they could be used to justify anything.

[arachne646]

05:28 PM on 09/01/2011

Many people who are attracted to others of the same sex feel exactly as you did when you applied to Baylor. What would you have them do? Abandon Christianity? Attend Baylor secretly, conform to the same student code of conduct you did, but feeling conflicted all the time and not knowing if God hated him or her and not being able to concentrate, at the very least; but at least living and studying where people shared her/his values and beliefs about the purpose of life? Wouldn't it be better to just be honest about how some people feel attraction and love towards people of her/his own gender and have them be a part of everything you enjoyed about Baylor? Don't they deserve a chance to live and study there too, in abstinence like every other student, without secrecy, shame, and "I struggle with how I feel about how Christians should view homosexuality"--perhaps because during your College years you never knowingly met any Christian homosexual students or faculty? We as Christians are not called to wall ourselves off from those in the Church we find uncomfortable--we have feelings that are sinful too, and we make mistakes too, even if we aren't queer. Gay and lesbian students and staff should be welcome at Baylor as long as they conform to the same code of conduct.

[Bob Kellerman]

03:49 AM on 09/02/2011

Sorry, but this is silly and unrealistic.

Donors to these Xtian colleges do not believe that Gays are not SOMEDAY going to have sex, and they won't let them marry, so Gays are just poor misguided future sinners to them, even if there is no sex at college. Worse yet, the Gays may change the thinking of the other kids, as you suggest, with their open presence.

Encouraging open Gayness means discouraging donors, and discouraging rich right-wing alumni from sending their kids and money.

IT'S THE REPUBLICAN SOUTH -- LYING IS NATURAL TO THEM
HONESTY ABOUT SEX IS THE LAST THING THEY WANT

[googlymoogly1]

09:52 AM on 09/02/2011

I don't know what I'd have others do. It's one of the reasons I'm thinking about it and trying to figure it out. Above all I would not have anyone abandon christianity, for this reason anyway. Let me ask you this: It's my perspective that one of the pillars that makes Baylor unique is it's slowness (and sometimes) unwillingness to bend to the ways of the world. The world comes along and say abortion is OK, Baylor says I'll pass on that. The world says sex isn't a sacrament and can be had whimsically, Baylor says I'll pass on that too. Now, along comes another position saying we want to be part of Baylor, it's special, you just need to do what the world is telling you to do? Does this mean that all institutions should be ready to change their beliefs as soon as culture changes for fear of being called bigots? There are TONS of religious institutions that have totally come into line with the Christian Gay position. Why not choose one of them? Why is it important to make Baylor be like them? Why do you need another Duke, Harvard, Yale, Brown, St. Thomas, etc. Why not just go to those schools? While I'm thinking about how I feel about the position that Homosexuality isn't a sin, for my part, this argument is as much about having to be the same as it is anything else.

[CForehand]

09:30 AM on 09/01/2011

I have two degrees from Baylor and am a faculty member. The reason Baylor does not have an LGBT student organization is valid. I'm not saying you have to agree with this, but this is the reasoning: Baylor will not back an organization that blatantly goes against Biblical teachings. Because the Bible clearly states that practicing homosexuality is wrong, it would be hypocritical for Baylor to support an organization that promotes that lifestyle. I do not believe that LGBT students should be made to feel ostracized or bullied in any way, however, if they choose to attend a Christian institution, they should be prepared to follow the institution's policies. If they don't, there are hundreds of other schools they could attend that are openly supportive of the LGBT lifestyle.

[Counterglow]

10:37 PM on 08/31/2011

I'm not clear on this. Does Baylor (I'm struggling manfully not to refer to it as "Gaylor") go even further than the Catholic Church, and insist that merely being homosexual is grounds for sanction? Or does Baylor simply have an issue with practicing homosexuality?

I'm SO glad I'm not religious, and don't have to care what the sexual orientation, colour or religion of my friends happens to be.

[CForehand]

09:39 AM on 09/01/2011

Baylor is against practicing homosexuality. It will not expel a student just for being a homosexual. I've been at Baylor for 7 years and I've never heard of a student being expelled for anything having to do with homosexuality.

[Todd G Chavey]

07:48 PM on 08/31/2011

People should be looked at for their integrity and honesty. If you must do background checks then do so, but personal life should not be considered in shape or form within the walls of any intstitutions or businesses.

[Amy Yvette Garrou]

05:03 PM on 08/31/2011

Still thinking about this and it occurred to me: isn't it illegal for an employer to bring up sexual orientation when hiring? How would Baylor search committees find out if a potential faculty member is gay or lesbian, except to ask? (Assuming the person being interviewed doesn't volunteer that information, which most people--gay or straight--don't volunteer in a job interview or on a CV).

Perhaps, again, it relates to the issue of what religious-oriented institutions can and can't do. I don't know if their private-school status gives them any protection in hiring practices, but maybe their status as a religious-oriented institution does?

Obviously with somebody like Ken Starr at the helm (I mean as a very well-informed and astute lawyer), Baylor must have concluded it's somehow legal to find out a job applicant's sexual orientation, and (it sounds like) to use sexual orientation as one way to disqualify a potential faculty member, but it would be interesting to hear the back-story on that issue.

[Mark Osler]

05:54 PM on 08/31/2011

Private, religious schools may legally (as Free Exercise of Religion) discriminate in this way. Amy, my point isn't one of law (can Baylor do it), it is one of Christian morality (should Baylor do it). There should be a vigorous debate on this latter question, because it is so important.

[Amy Yvette Garrou]

07:36 PM on 08/31/2011

I have written a post on this point, too--whether Baylor should discriminate re: Christian morality--but evidently it hasn't shown up yet. I hope there is debate on it.

Sorry, I was not intending to assume any legal expertise, but this discrimination just seems wrong from many angles, even if it's legal.

[gmikejake]

06:03 AM on 09/01/2011

As a now retired college professor/administrator who has also taught at religious, and very conservative, universities, please know that such discrimination does occur, regularly. It is just done on the basis of "impression," and, of course, "belief." I have directly experienced the negative effects of this "subjective" way of knowing and can testify, in some detail, to the extreme difficulties of such situations. You cannot effectively counter something that is "not there." And it is ALWAYS denied these days. So one just leaves if you are "outed." In order to be avoid being "outed," as being "different," you must be very careful and, typically, very silent. Even that does not always work. So you just leave. And administrators, faculty, staff, students who are "different" do leave. And are silent. And the situation continues. Please see The Help for some understanding of some of the dynamics. This is not just about racism, or homophobia, either, it can pertain to any form of stigmatized "difference."

[Holly R Tawil]

03:24 PM on 08/31/2011

Great article. I know Baylor alumni have a strong pull in their alma mater's social policies, many of whom identify as Southern Baptists. Baylor is open about their policies and anyone in Texas (at least) knows it is an uber-conservative college in a very conservative town. However, with the advent of social media, civil rights, and more students exploring various higher education options, Baylor must decide whether they want to stand by their traditions OR recruit and retain the smartest student cohorts possible.

[Rbnorms]

12:51 PM on 09/02/2011

I just wanted to say that Waco is actually not as conservative as you might think. Also, Baylor's goal, as an institution, is to becoming a leading academic institution both in research and teaching while still believing and holding to the Christian teachings of the Bible as well as traditional teachings.

I think it is wrong to say that if they stand by their traditions means that they will not be able to retain and recruit the smartest students possible. That seems to say that only stupid people believe in Christian traditions. Baylor professes just the opposite, that Christian students, can and a lot of times are, the best and brightest students.

[arachne646]

04:30 PM on 09/04/2011

The more educated a person is, though, the more sophisticated their faith becomes, in most cases. "Because the Bible says so" is an appeal to authourity. If one's study and knowledge of history, religion, and science (and logic) becomes greater than what one learned in Sunday School and literalist Bible Class, a lot more comes to light--the Enlightenment, Copernicus, how recently fundamentalism and a literalist interpretation of the Bible became common, the world's Great Books, other civilizations other than Europe, other viewpoints on the Bible, and many, many more--I forgot really weird physics

So that education does not necessarily lead to atheism, although atheists say rationalism and religion cannot go together--many people combine an open and active mind with an unhardened and open heart to God.

[Wittgenstein]

02:20 PM on 08/31/2011

The article only demonstrates that bigotry, ignorance and hatred continues to be a staple of Christianity.

[arachne646]

05:51 PM on 09/01/2011

Why do you say that? This is a University in the middle of Texas, USA, supported primarily by a football team. OK, I guessed at the last one, but if I've ever heard of a college fb team, it must be a big source of alumni cash, and this is Texas. So this is a very, very conservative area that we are talking about. The article itself is written on why, on the basis of Christian love, the unwritten policy of "no LGBT" is wrong. Mark Osler also says in what ways his present, Catholic, teaching post is better--even though this is a denomination that is notoriously hierarchical compared to most denominations, but groups of Catholics vary tremendously from ultra-conservative to very progressive. You can find Christians that are open-minded, loving and welcoming in all parts of the US, but they don't get the headlines. There is not a breakdown of how many KeystoneXL protestors came with their Church, and my denomination's banner in the city's Pride Parade is not an eye-catcher, but the staple diet of a lot of us is praying and working for a better world, where the people who are forgotten now are the most important--not just relief for the poor, but justice where justice is denied. But until then, we try to follow Jesus.

[Rbnorms]

01:10 PM on 09/02/2011

Just to let you know. Baylor wishes it was supported more by it's football team. Mostly the university is run by endowments from past alumni and tuition instead of sports. In fact, it's alumni are extremely generous in giving back. I am currently enrolled in the theater and film departments at Baylor and I know for a fact that only a handful of students out of the (roughly) 200 students in the Baylor Theater Department do not have some form of academic scholarship.

[mrld20]

12:53 PM on 08/31/2011

Great article! Keep fighting for LGBT support on Christian campuses!

[ThinkCreeps]

05:41 AM on 08/31/2011

Frankly, no-one with an ounce of sense was going to teach or study there anyway.

[MNgril85]

09:32 AM on 08/31/2011

This statement is as narrow-minded and out-of-touch as Baylor's policy.

[ThinkCreeps]

10:33 AM on 08/31/2011

Thank you.

It was definitely long after time for a laugh, and that's the best one I've had for a while.

[TryToBeFlexible]

02:50 PM on 08/31/2011

Let's see. Children who grow up gay, in far right christian households, with no support from family, friends, school, live in fear of being found out. This leads to crippling depression and suicide. Therefore, this kind of policy leads to death or at least deep psychological harm for innocent children. But, according to you, it is narrow minded to feel that there is no sense in Baylor's arguably evil policies.
On one side, gays have never harmed Baylor, never will. On the other side, Baylor is causing great harm, and probably death, to innocent gay children. But, it is narrow minded to call out Baylor on their harmful policies? How nice to be so even handed, in the face of children being tormented to death! You must be proud of your high moral stance!

[Thinkster]

07:26 PM on 08/31/2011

I have to wonder myself - does this bastion of higher learning have any special attribution that would be considered useful in the real world?

[ThinkCreeps]

02:02 AM on 09/01/2011

No, but it does makes a lot of money from its indoctrination, gets to avoid paying its own tax and shelters its alumnis' contributions.

[iLdoRight]

02:33 AM on 08/31/2011

The number of people who want Our Creator's approval strongly enough to "brow beat" themselves or to "force themselves" to comply with Our Creator's desires for His human creation is probably very small in relation to the number who just want to imply that God loves them and approves of what they are. Acts 10:34,35 indicate that in every nationality those who are trying to live and promote the righteousness He wants His human subjects to live and promote are acceptable to Him, but what if they are not? If airplanes, trains and autos were built with only bolts to bolts and crazy glue connections, how many would give the manufacturers their stamp of approval?

[green752]

04:42 AM on 08/31/2011

"If airplanes, trains and autos were built with only bolts to bolts and crazy glue connection­s, how many would give the manufactur­ers their stamp of approval?"

I'm not sure I follow what you mean. Could you elaborate a bit more?

[TryToBeFlexible]

02:52 PM on 08/31/2011

It is making a reference to male to male connections in gay sex, and to gay marriage. It feels it knows all the answers to all cosmic questions, is on the "in" with god, and everyone else who disagrees is going to hell.

[iLdoRight]

04:37 PM on 08/31/2011

It is obvious from looking at the "nut and bolt" type connectors that each has been designed for their part in making a good connection, there are also, "washers and lock washers" that are beneficial for a good secure connection that will last and hold together in severs vibrations and temperature changes. If one were to understand all the physical, mental and emotional differences as well as the natural abilities that one can observe as differences between the males and females one can determine that a union of a male and female, physically, emotionally, supportively can create a bond that should be much more beneficial than two bolts held together with "crazy glue". Money is sometimes the "crazy glue" that holds two together, but there is something much better and stronger than money.

[cleigh23]

11:59 PM on 08/30/2011

As a current student of Baylor University, I was very happy to see this article. Although I am not gay, many of my close friends here are. I'm also a member of the Sexual Identity Forum as well.
Though the article makes very accurate and important points, I feel that it's a little overwhelming and accusatory. Although the main policies against homosexuality are pretty sickening, my personal experience with many of the faculty at Baylor have been very positive when it is regarding to these issues.
I've talked with multiple professors about my feelings towards change in these policies and many agree that changes need to be made, especially with hiring LGBT faculty.
The Baylor SIF (SIFembears.com) meets weekly and draws bigger audiences every time.
Although these may seem like small things to many outsiders, I really do feel that many of the students and some of the faculty are working towards moving our university forward.
I do really enjoy my overall experience at Baylor, and it may take time but I hope that my efforts to try and support a change in these awful policies will inspire others and the administration to actually take a step forward.

[Mark Osler]

10:19 AM on 08/31/2011

Cleigh23-- I didn't mean to be accusatory toward the faculty, because I see what you do-- many, if not most of them agree with me.

Can I come to your meeting on Thursday? I will be in Waco.

[BOBinPS]

07:34 PM on 08/31/2011

Sounds to me like the conversation between Catholics and their "church".

Many Catholics do not like the doctrine of the papacy, or the bishop-pricks. But, they go along with it, hoping it will get better....eventually.

Just get out! Let it die the death it deserves.

[arachne646]

11:55 AM on 09/02/2011

Easy to say! But what if everything you loved about your family (I sure hope you do), and it were a big family with aunts, cousins, grandfathers, etc. was spoiled by the bossy, know-it-all sisters who organized everything? Marry someone and join their family? Move to an island? The family is more than those bossy know-it-alls. Mind you, in Canada, a lot of same-sex and divorced Catholics come to our denomination for weddings.

[green752]

11:37 PM on 08/30/2011

Thank you John. As a Baylor alum, I can say that I love my school dearly, but part of me never felt truly at peace there. I've only recently accepted my sexuality and come out, and am now looking at seminaries and divinity schools and am finding that so many have policies similar to Baylor's. There are many gay and lesbian students at Baylor. Far more than anyone realizes or would care to admit.

Baylor is not known to be a place of free thought - faculty have been dismissed for speaking critically or contrary to administrative policy. Some departments are so restricted that they dare not speak of sexuality at all. Even the one course the University offers on sexuality relies on a censored text book and skirts around many issues, though my professor did as good of a job as they could given the constructs of the class. Sadly, for many, this was their first introduction to anything pertaining to sex ed. Many in the class had never seen methods of contraception, let alone knew how to use them.

Baylor has a strong Christian identity- something that drew and kept many of us there despite the universities moral clause. Baylor does not bar gay and lesbian students per se, but any inappropriate behavior (as determined by the University) can be deemed as grounds for expulsion.
The actual policy on sexual misconduct may be found here: http://www.baylor.edu/content/services/document.php?id=39247

[reasonable111]

01:28 AM on 08/31/2011

It is clear that Baylor is a Christian institution and is following many Christian precepts that preclude homosexual behavior.

This is explicit in the scriptures and a private institution can do what it pleases regarding this.

This article is just an attempt to water down what a Christian institution says about homosexual behavior.

[Bob Kellerman]

04:18 AM on 08/31/2011

CHRIST WAS NOT JUDGEMENTAL

If you are foolish enough to think that this "Christian institution" does not dishonor Jesus in order to keep the lid on students, may I suggest you think again?

[green752]

04:39 AM on 08/31/2011

You are right, as a private university, Baylor is entitled to do as they wish. Even if those policies are discriminatory (except those that violate title 9 stipulations).

What disturbs me about this policy (and others like it) is that:
1. it lists "homosexual acts" in a group of crimes with "sexual abuse, sexual harassment, sexual assault, incest" (adultery may not be a crime, but I don't know of anyone that endorses it as moral) where simply stopping at "fornication" would be sufficient.
2. the term "homosexual acts" (or in other policies at other schools "homosexual behavior" is vague - so is this just left up to one's interpretation? My point being, could two students "caught" holding hands or kissing be grounds for this code to be applied?
3. Excluding faculty solely of their orientation is wrong. It in know way affects their intellectual credibility or performance and Baylor risks (and has) lost tremendous talent as a result of this.

I'll close with this I could debate what is explicit in the scriptures (my Baylor education taught me well), but this is not the place for it. One can be Christian and gay, participate in church and serve in ministry. Many of us do. Being gay isn't about sex. It is a sexual orientation. What a person does or doesn't do, is up to them. The point of this article is to call for Baylor to end selective discrimination - not endorse gay relationships or sexual acts of its students.