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Elisabeth Hasselbeck, Survivor Contestant: "Only The People Should Amend The Constitution"
Elisabeth Hasselbeck wants you to know that the recent Prop 8 vote in California is particularly special because it "came from the People," and that "Only the People should vote to amend the Constitution."
Um.... No.
If we left it up to The People, Liz, you wouldn't be allowed to vote to begin with. You also wouldn't get equal pay and you'd be sitting in front of Whoopi on the bus ride home.
How about free speech? You want to rail against our new president, Elisabeth? Put Free Speech to a vote on the day after a terrorist attack on American soil and see if The People would tolerate it. I think you'd find that The People aren't exactly reasonable in a time of crisis.
The problem with people like Elisabeth Hasselbeck is that, one, they only like the intervention of judges when it helps them (see "Florida Recount") and, two, they like to endow The People with more wisdom than reality (or the reality show) supports. It's a romantic notion that The People can be trusted to be reasonable, deliberate, and just. The truth is that The People are often anything but (see "Selma march"). The People don't even act in their own best interests when you remove ideology from the equation entirely. Stock market goes up, people get greedy and buy without employing any reason whatsoever (see "Dot-Com Bubble"). It goes down and those same people sell with wild-eyed terror (see "Crash of 2008").
You can't trust that The People are even remotely educated on the issues. Those of you who live in a state that votes on individual laws, think about how much time you spend on those propositions before you vote. Chances are you read a one-paragraph blurb in your sample ballot over a bowl of cereal on Election Day. If that. Are you truly weighing the pros and cons? Have you read the proposal itself, looked at the statutes on the books, heard from those who would be directly affected? Of course not. That's why we have a congress that holds hearings and why we have courts who listen to both sides of the issue. If you can't cook and you want a good meal you go to a great restaurant. If you don't know how to legislate you vote for people who do.
No, it's not perfect and it's not always going to work out the way you like. Welcome to the club. But to entrust a decision to the masses that would deprive any individual of basic human rights is worse than "legislating from the bench," it's legislating from a park bench.
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Melissa Etheridge Takes On Elisabeth Hasselbeck Over Prop 8 (VIDEO)
Melissa Etheridge stopped by "The View" Tuesday, but before singing a Christmas song she challenged co-host Elisabeth Hasselbeck about Prop 8. Etheridge married partner Tammy...
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Exactly right, excellent article. At the same time, it can also be used as an explanation to Obama being president, and Bush before him.
Elizabeth has already proven herself to be,the type of person who forms an opinion without investigation based on her narrow beliefs,ignorant.She will most likely become another Ann Coulter,loud,common and not taken seriously.
Good points, and I agree. It's our court protections of our rights that keeps the nation on the right track. Left to its own devices, we'd be anarchists in no time!
"If we left it up to The People, Liz, you wouldn't be allowed to vote to begin with. You also wouldn't get equal pay and you'd be sitting in front of Whoopi on the bus ride home."
If you are under the impression that women's suffrage or equal accomodations came as the result of court decisions, you are mistaken. Both came about as the reult of congressional action - a constitutional amendment and a federal statute - and in the case of the constitutional amendment, ratification by three quarters of the states.
I bet EH knows that.
See Michael Seitzman's Profile
Read it again. My point is very clear, that those issues were not put to a vote by the electorate and if they had been they wouldn't have passed.
You wrote it, so I guess you know what you were trying to say. I take, then, that you would favor returning to the original constitutional mehod of choosing US Senators - selection by state legislators rather than popular election.
Does anyone know what the actual procedure for amending the CA constitution is? Is it simply a majority vote on a proposition?
Nope.
Specific changes to the California constitution may be proposed by amendment. Substantial changes may be proposed by a constitutional convention or by the legislature as constitutional revisions. Regardless of their origin, all changes must be approved by a majority of the electorate
voting on the issue.
Legislative amendments, the method most commonly used, require a two-thirds vote in each house of the legislature.
Initiative amendments maybe placed on the ballot by a petition of registered voters equal in number to 8 percent of the total vote cast in the preceding gubernatorial election.
Therein lies the current court case controversy over Prop 8.
The supporters say it was a simple amendment subject to the Initiative Amendment process only.
Those against Prop 8 say it was a substantial amendment and required either a constitutional convention or the Two-Step process of a 2/3 Legislative approval followed by a majority vote of the people.
For arguments why it does or not constitute a substantial amendment the briefs filed by both sides are available from the California Supreme Court. Incidentally, the Attorney General, Jerry Brown, has now decided that it DOES constitute a substantial amendment and therefore should be overturned. Some are outraged he is not "doing his job" and representing the "government" in upholding it. He actually IS doing his job which is not simply to uphold actions by the people (which this was) but to determine if such actions are lawful and then argue appropriately in court.
Interesting, thanks!
More like legislating from a church pew in this particular case.
People like EH should not be given a voice to infuence people. She clearly does not educate herself on the issues and screams out untruths day in day out. I am appalled that Barbara Walters has been snowed by this nonsense and allows it to go on. It is one thing to have differing opinions but lets have someone who has the intellegence to discuss in a civil manner and is able to do so with the facts not drivel from the likes of Limbaugh.
nice kid...
The problem with people like Elisabeth Hasselbeck is that, one, she's on TV and, two, that she's on TV!!!
As usual Hasselbeck hasn't a clue!
While everyone is entitle to their opinion, the more this woman talks the more we realize she is not ready for 'Prime Time". I guess when one's only claim to fame has been being a contestant on "Survivor" ,we should not expect too much in the way of offering intelligent public discourse.
But don't forget that she *is* overqualified to be a GOP Vice Presidential candidate.
The word is HYPOCRITICAL.... too many of the "Elizabeths" in this country want us to live as they say and not as they do. They want to scream about too much government and then want government to step in and manage my bedroom activities and who I love.
Barbara Walters, The View co-hosts, and any viewers of the show, should want to get rid of Elizabeth. She does not help round out the conversation, she points out a bigoted far right point of view that needs to be eliminated in the country if we are really going to have equality, get past bigotry, and move ahead to the future.
To better clarify, it is like giving a Neo-Nazi a podium to speak at in your school. She is given that podium five days a week and helps to justify peoples small-mindedness, bigotry and hate. SHE NEEDS TO GO. Let her preach on the street corner, not be given a platform by, I thought, a respected woman media personality, Barbara Walters.
she's perfect for faux news....exactly how they frame things......
snap!
I'm a member of the democratic underground dot com. That's where I get all the pros and cons on different propositions in our state and federal elections. Very smart people are there, many attorneys, people of all race, creed, religion, profession.
If I'm confused about a bill, or just want to know more about it I go there for my research where I can immediately interact with fellow Dems and Progressives and get a broader view and perspective before I make my decision. Sadly, the majority of Americans don't do this kind of simple research. That's why Prop h8 passed.
I think also the "majority" of Americans believe they live in a "democracy", instead of the Democratic Representative Republic called the United States, governed by a Constitution which provides for - at the Federal Level - a tri-parte system of government with Co-Equal branches - Executive, Legislative and Judicial - and which as the highest law in the land provides for the powers of such branches and checks and balances that they have on each other, as well as providing rules for changing that highest law of the land.
I guess that means they should be speaking Ancient Greek instead of modern English as the last time such a form of government actually existed was probably in Ancient Athens.
The electoral college should've been the tip-off that it's not a democracy, but a lot of people I speak/write with don't even know we have an electoral college. It's time we bring civics lessons back into our childrens' curriculum.
BTW, a LOT of people didn't even know we live in a Constitutional Democratic Republic. I was one of them up until 2004, and until I listened to Thom Hartmann on Air America after seeing him on C-Span when they had that broadcast of political radio personalities. He was the smartest, most knowledgeable one they had on.
Our system of checks and balances between the 3 branches was really a brilliant stroke by our founders.
But I, for one, am tired of the lack of respect shown to our judiciary by people ignorant of the way our government is meant to work.
A state legislature can pass a law stating that blue haired ladies over 70 can't shop at Albertson's on Tuesday afternoons. (Google 'stupid laws', there's been a ton). It is then up to our courts to decide is this law passes constitutional muster, as well it should be. Popular opinion does not make a law constitutional, thank heaven.
I absolutely agree w/you and have stated to my friends and family that the gay/lesbian community will not stand a chance as long as it's left up to the people to vote in their favor. The people's vote will always be influenced by religion and the guilt of voting against their religion belief, their ignorance of the law and constitution (which is understandable considering the lack of a law school education) and the fear of an unfamiliar community and the influences it may have on their lives. Therefore, the gay/lesbian wants/rights will always have to be decided by a less emotional and law abiding entity that understands the law and constitution, i.e., The Supreme Court. If they continue to leave their hope with the people, they need to do a better job of educating the public and combating the misinformation and opinions of their opposition. They simply rested on their laurels and failed at the marketing of their views to the general public. I don't know if it would have made a difference, but people I know who voted for Prop 8 but are quite liberal in their views were bombarded by calls and marketing materials from Prop 8 proponents and little to no information from its opponents. Yeah, they should have researched the facts. However, if you're trying to sell something to the mass market, it's your job to convince them to buy your product instead of your competitors.
Thank you for this article. People truly enjoy having their prejudices confirmed by others, and obviously that is what the Prop 8 vote did for Elisabeth. But it's just not okay to oppress people -- ever. I don't know what America's obsession is with "the average joe" but I'm glad we finally elected a President who is actually smarter than me.
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