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Paul Abrams

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Why Should I Pay for Your Skiing Accident?

Posted: 03/ 9/2012 8:34 am

I have previously written about Rush Limbaugh's vicious defamation against Sandra Fluke.

But, apart from the slander, there is an underlying (false) premise in the Limbaugh attack that should not be ignored because it insinuates itself into the public consciousness.

I am going to "sanitize" Limbaugh's comments so we do not focus on its cowardly and scandalous attacks on Ms. Fluke, but rather its basic (false) premise.

Limbaugh attacked the idea of "paying" for the consequences of someone else's pleasures.

Although Limbaugh stated it was taxpayers doing the paying, and seemed to believe that the more sex the more contraceptive pills or devices are used, we will let him off the hook on those for these purposes, and just correct him without comment, that it is private insurers that would be doing the paying, not taxpayers, and that contraceptive use is unrelated to frequency of sex.

Let us even indulge the fiction that premiums are higher when birth control is included -- actually, birth control saves the insurer money because it reduces unwanted pregnancies -- but, to make the point, let us say they are higher, and thus I, as a premium payer, am "forced" to pay for your pleasures. As Limbaugh said, there are alternatives to contraception such as celibacy.

Or (sanitized), why, says Limbaugh, should other insurance premium payers pay for women's pleasures?

But, what about skiing? That is a pleasure. (Indeed, I am told there are actually a few people who enjoy both skiing AND sex, hard as that may be to believe.) Suppose you go skiing and fracture your ankle, requiring surgery, casting, and rehabilitation. Any insurance company will know statistically that there will be a fraction of their enrollees who will need that treatment, and thus take account of that possibility in their premium calculations.

So, here I am again, as a premium payer, paying for your pleasure, this time skiing. You had alternatives. You could not have gone skiing at all. You could have been less aggressive on the slopes. You could have confined yourself to the nursery slopes. But, for your own pleasure, you came hurtling down the black diamond slopes and destroyed your ankle, and I am paying for it.

Is there a difference between skiing and sex?

Of course there is. Skiing = good. Sex = bad.

And that, really, is what this is all about, isn't it?

It has nothing to do with others in the insurance pool paying for someone's pleasure.

 

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aspertame2
Micro-bio redacted, for your protection
01:40 AM on 03/10/2012
THANK YOU for that very apt analogy. Yep, if we are going to get our partitions in a wad over sexy sexy discretionary medical needs, what else is discretionary (besides s-e-x) that "we" shouldn't have to pay for? Viagra, certainly. Vasectomies, of course. Need a malaria shot because you are volunteering for your church's mission south of the equator? Why should *I* pay for your discretionary do-gooder risky health behaviors? And it's not *my* fault you let your kid go swimming and now he has an ear infection. Sheesh. The entitlement attitude of Some People!
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HUFFPOST BLOGGER
Valerie Tarico
10:48 PM on 03/09/2012
It's actually cheaper for employers to cover contraceptives than not per Joshua Holland at alternet: http://www.alternet.org/story/154431/how_republicans_are_trying_to_force_you_to_pay_for_others%27_religious_beliefs/ . When contraceptive coverage gets excluded because of religious fundamentalism, everybody in the insurance pool pays a higher price.
Genders
Love, Tolerance, Enlightenment
04:46 PM on 03/09/2012
The Burke conservative want to return to the pre French revolution days of wealth ruling the 99% serfs.

No benefits, no "collective" democracy to help anyone but the rich.

Just what our Locke Liberal founders were fighting against: Burke conservative Big money multinational empires.
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HUFFPOST COMMUNITY MODERATOR
SageFire
Research Vote by Mail
04:06 PM on 03/09/2012
Single payer. Problem solved (not to mention a ton of other ones).
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Liviu
I support the right to arm the bears.
03:35 PM on 03/09/2012
(Indeed, I am told there are actually a few people who enjoy both skiing AND sex, hard as that may be to believe.)

This got me laughing, and that's because I'm one of those people... he...he
HUFFPOST PUNDIT
bklynsparrow
creating reality from unreal things
03:40 PM on 03/10/2012
No! I'm shocked! Shocked! (Am I supposed to pay for the broken ankle you got when you fell off the bed during sex and hit your ski boot?) The nerve. All I can say is you better be procreating while you're doing that stuff!  ;-)
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essbird
IOKIYANO
02:36 PM on 03/09/2012
You're applying way too much logic and reason. Don't forget what's behind this: A confusing, contradictory collection of Bronze Age myths about what the Creator does and doesn't want us to do, and what He'll do to us if we disobey. There's a lot of information about what He thinks about nookie in there. Unfortunately, given the locale of His activities, he didn't have anything to tell us about skiing.
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HUFFPOST COMMUNITY MODERATOR
SageFire
Research Vote by Mail
04:05 PM on 03/09/2012
F&F. No invisible dads in public health policy!!
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paxatman
Do no harm, Help others.
10:57 AM on 03/10/2012
Moses did some fine moguls coming down from the mount. Lost 4 of the 6 tablets during the run also. All pertaining to not listening to political parties who claim to be holier than others and how to smit, smite and smack em.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Patriot86
Compassion is the basis of all morality.
02:02 PM on 03/09/2012
Great post! And while we are at it...why should I have to pay as a taxpayer for Rush's future illnesses caused by his cigar smoking and pill popping?
03:07 PM on 03/09/2012
It is very hard to separate behavior and outcome in paying for health care. If you allow people to exclude coverage for smoking induced issues (sort of like a good driver discount) then you will go down a slippery slope of allowing more healthy people to pay less for insurance. But, I agree than some form of accounting for ones actions is necessary to keep usage in line.
This user has chosen to opt out of the Badges program
12:27 PM on 03/09/2012
The author brings up an important point and it's about more than Rush Limbaugh's comments. Everybody wants insurance to pay for what they want and need but not necessarily what the other guy or gal wants and needs. It's like taxes. It's a complicated issue. We all need to realize that once you start letting insurance companies tell people how they can and can't live their lives then there goes the freedom.
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08politicaljunkie
Save a soldier. Boycott NASCAR
12:24 PM on 03/09/2012
Eye-opening. Excellent argument. Thanks.

Oh, and by the way, I refuse to go on Facebook too. So you're not the last.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
bethinaz
12:01 PM on 03/09/2012
It's not skiing = good; sex = bad - it's women/sex = bad
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Inkosi
The gods themselves rage against stupidity
12:03 PM on 03/09/2012
And who is going to pay for Boehner's lliver problems arising from alcohol or skin cancer from his sun tan machines.? Answer - you and me - the tax payer. He gete free health benefits. (or at least FREE to him - we the tax payers pay the bill).
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08politicaljunkie
Save a soldier. Boycott NASCAR
12:25 PM on 03/09/2012
We pay for all their game playing
This user has chosen to opt out of the Badges program
12:46 PM on 03/09/2012
Republicans are all about what serves them best and not the country, you'd have to a billionaire or at least a millionaire to reward them with elective office, or you'd have to believe and what they tell Joe The Plumber, "you too one day could be one of us", which in reality is less of an opportunity when they hold office. I am amazed how they get even one vote from ordinary Americans!!!
03:06 PM on 03/09/2012
Absolutely right! And they want to punish women for being sexual. Fear and hatred of women and womens' sexuality are the real issue here, not religion, not insurance, not who pays for what.
11:58 AM on 03/09/2012
Why does it never come up that Socialized medicine is far more efficient than the mish-mash of part Socialized, part private mess that we have? We pay about 16% of GDP for health care and rank far down in worldwide health statistics. Switzerland is second, spending about 11% of GDP. They have the only mandated all-private insurance plan.

Without the 40% or so, of people on socialized medicine (govt. employees, medicare, medicaid, CHIP and others), we would rank in the third world. Our medical infrastructure is some of the best in the world (that is what John Boehner is talking about) but our system of distribution and access is dreadful and Big Money is keeping it that way. Heaven help the small business owner or self-insured person with the dreaded Pre-Existing Conditions in their family.

Of course, members of Congress are completely immune from these concerns. If I could get their plan, I would shut up about the whole thing.
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08politicaljunkie
Save a soldier. Boycott NASCAR
12:21 PM on 03/09/2012
to borrow from Mr. Abrams

Capitalism = good
Socialism = bad
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Patriot86
Compassion is the basis of all morality.
02:05 PM on 03/09/2012
Wrong, capitalism as practiced these last 30 years had beena disaster for this country...millions of jobs were sent overseas and for what? So the few and the wealthy could maximize profits...then we encourage Europe to give it a try and now they are practically bankrupt as are we...our form of captilism has ruined the world economy.
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HUFFPOST COMMUNITY MODERATOR
SageFire
Research Vote by Mail
02:10 PM on 03/09/2012
But what we have is:

Socialism for the wealthy = good
Socialism for all the rest of us = bad.
This user has chosen to opt out of the Badges program
12:31 PM on 03/09/2012
What really gets me is that the government by taking on Medicare and Medicaid bears the brunt of the costs of the highest risk groups, the poor and the elderly and takes them out of the insurance risk pool. This allows insurance companies to make huge profits while the taxpayer essentially subsidizes them. If we all just paid our money into a government run healthcare program we would get more for less. Medicare proves this.
madisgp
All we-we'd up.
12:46 PM on 03/09/2012
As does the Veterans health care system.
02:05 PM on 03/09/2012
You get it. I hope that you write your congressman as well as me or the Huffington post. I live in a state so Red, that endeavor is a waste of time but I do it anyway as a sort of exercise in futility.
11:35 AM on 03/09/2012
Two points:

1st. Given all the hyperbole from the right over not wanting to pay for other people's pleasurable, but "risky" behaviour, it's surprising that we haven't seen the right make a greater push to criminalize smoking and booze, given the health costs to both the government and private businesses. Maybe someone should ask them about that? I guess not, there' s no "moral objection" to that one . . .

2nd. For most Republican's your analogy isn't going to work. They [say they] don't consider the actual sex bad, just them paying for one's contraception. So using your comparison, I think they'd consider the contraception the lift ticket . . . and maybe the broken ankle is a baby?
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Inkosi
The gods themselves rage against stupidity
12:05 PM on 03/09/2012
O(h my - just think about all those young interns being banged by those congressmen!
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QuercusQate
Nomo DOMA.
11:31 AM on 03/09/2012
Does anyone have any theories about why the GOP is obsessed with controlling other people's sexual behavior? I don't get it.
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Inkosi
The gods themselves rage against stupidity
12:06 PM on 03/09/2012
It diverts attention from the important issues at which they have been dismal failures.
This user has chosen to opt out of the Badges program
12:33 PM on 03/09/2012
Ain't that the God's truth!
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Cleverboots
12:20 PM on 03/09/2012
Jealousy? LOL!
11:30 AM on 03/09/2012
As a population control supporter I am 100% in favor of having free access to contraception. It will indeed be less expensive than the alternative, and is the only way to reduce our impact on the globe. Driving a Prius with three kids is far worse than driving a Hummer with two.

That being said, there is a difference between insurance for the unforeseen injury or disease, and things that are just consumed. Insuring your car (body) against the possibility of an accident spreads the risk over many drivers (people) who are unlikely to all have one. Including an annual oil change (viagra or contraception supplies or a dental cleaning) will simply increase everyone's cost by the cost of the oil change (etc.) . It also means that the actual consumer will not bother to seek out the most cost effective alternatives. Without some individual responsibility the cost of health care will continue to rise. Witness Ms. Fluke's $1,000 per year cost vs. the same at Walmart for $120.
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HUFFPOST SUPER USER
La Elle
I might be deaf but I'm not dumb
11:57 AM on 03/09/2012
Maybe we should be asking Pharmacutical companies why they are charging so much for contraception. Ms Fluke is merely the consumer.
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Inkosi
The gods themselves rage against stupidity
12:13 PM on 03/09/2012
It is porfitable and that is the goal - the bottom line.
12:52 PM on 03/09/2012
Precisely. It is available at multiple stores for roughly $120 a year, but if it is just an insurance company or the government that pays for it, $1,000 doesn't matter. We have to have the consumer thinking about the cost and benefit of their healthcare or it will continue to soar...whether provided by employers or the state.
HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Earl Gray
Lighting up straw men everywhere
01:18 PM on 03/09/2012
You make a very valid point which does apply to many of the treatments covered by the HHS Women's Wellness Guidelines (well woman visits, for instance), but, ironically, it does not quite apply to contraception.

Borrowing your analogy, contraception is more like, say, traffic control devices (stop lights, pavement markings, etc.). No single driver needs them (as anyone who has waited for a green light at 2 in the morning without a car in sight will attest), but which are to the benefit of all drivers when many cars are having to share the road.

Women are not the only beneficiaries of birth control. Indeed, by their very nature, two people directly benefit from it in every single case.

As for the cost of birth control, insurance companies can and do leverage their market muscle to keep costs lower. Allowing them to cover only generics (are there such for this medication?) or even setting up specific brands that they cover (as long as there are multiple brands of the same formula) could make this less expensive.

Finally, the $1000 VS Walmart at $120 per year doesn't match up. The $1000 if for the prescription without any insurance. The $120 per year is the co-pay, not the "full boat" price.
11:21 AM on 03/09/2012
My contribution in buying my medical insurance premium will help pay for your sexual activities or your skiing accident. The same as your insurance premium payment will help pay when i trip over my hoe when i am gardening in my yard for "pleasure." There is no practical way to separate out what human exercises and endeavors are only "necessary" or only "for pleasure" or only just living life. And we ALL pay - whether medically insured or under-insured or not insured at all when people seek medical care thru the ER because of cost-shifting and higher state/local taxes. We all PAY!