“Great post my friend, but you fail to understand the true mess we are in, ALL OF US.
You say what we need is Kennedycare, but sir, this is what most American already have. What Senators get is a menu of Blue Cross, Aetna, United plans to choose from, just like most Americans with employer provided coverage. True many Americans do not have the extensive menu choices, in fact I read that over half of employers offer only ONE private plan, no choice, but it is the same companys with similar plans.
What you fail to understand is that we pay DOUBLE what Europe pays, and get less. States are currently paying 30% of their budgets on health care, Medicare will be broke in 7 years, and the federal govt. is broke NOW! And you want to expand this so called system when we cant even afford it now.
You need to log on to healthtransformation.org and read what the conservatives offer. This is Newt Gingriches website and he offers more choice and more competition private insurance based solutions.”
“Dr. Ornish is absolutely correct. The question is HOW do we execute his vision.
The right believes in private companys, the left in big govt. Who should run a Ornish type better living program?
The real question is can we afford NOT to enact a healthier living initiative?
Consider that the bill for the explosion in obesity is not come due yet. These fat and happy Americans, my own family included, will see a rise in diabetes, heart disease, hip and knee replacements, inflammatory diseases, and on and on. We already have diabetes showing up in teenagers now.
Obama has not educated the American people that Medicare will be broke in 8 years. And that the states are already spending 30% of their budgets on health care. And that the baby boomers will certainly raise demand for health care two fold as they are both richer and less healtthy than the younger population. This will drive prices and demand up.
These facts would convince conservatives and liberals that change is needed NOW.
Dr. Ornish and his healthy living education program may or may not save money. We dont know. But it would improve our lifestyles. Imagine better sex lives, more energy, less side effects from drugs, more productivity at work, more cash in your pocket..........all from improving your health.
CAN WE AFFORD NOT TO DO Dr Ornishes healthy living program?”
KillgoreTrout43 on Aug 28, 2009 at 18:19:12
“Medicare will be broke in 8 years??? I don't think so. Of course it's a good idea to live a healthier lifestyle. ( I hate that term) But the quality of one's life doesn't always equate with the number of years lived.
The fact is, that health is really not the issue here. The issue is of an economic one. The healthcare industry is a hugely profitable one. The republicans, who always favor profit over principle, do not want any changes to the existing system. That is the reality here.
Preventive medicine will not stop broken bones, diabetes (which, in most cases is hereditary), heart disease, infectious diseases, degenerative disease and any number of cancers. Car crashes, falls, airplane crashes....etc. Our existing healthcare system is hugely expensive and remains far too expensive for the most basic of illness or injury. Then we have Swine Flu threatening to kill nearly 90,000 Americans in the coming year. No amount of lifestyle changes will stop that or other influenza.”
Just wanted to say that you are in fact right that heads will roll as a result from this debate.
Where you are wrong is that Democrats are the ones who will pay for this debacle. Conservatives are outraged and pissed off that liberals are taking over and conservatives are going to show up big time in 2010. Liberals on the other hand will be depressed that they got a very weak health care bill, no global warming bill, and no new taxes on the rich.
Conservatives need only say one thing in the next election.................DEFICIT.........and liberals will be dead in the water.
Turnout is the key to elections, and conservatives are motivated by Obama. Independents are not agreeing with Obama care and will likely want to rein in the left in the next election.”
blondieboop on Aug 18, 2009 at 00:02:54
“Do you really think that the millions of un and underinsured citizens are going to vote Republican next year if there isn't some kind of health care bill passed? People are so desperate for health care in this country that they line up for hours to get treatment at a sports arena from a group of docs who normally help the poor in Haiti or isolated parts of the Amazon. It may not bother those Republican senators that our health care system is a disaster but of course they get free health care at Walter Reed or Bethesda payed for by taxpayers. Socialized health care is apparently good enough for them but not for us little people.”
Lilli917 on Aug 17, 2009 at 22:15:39
“Well, why weren't you Conservatives concerned when George Bush was spending his hugh surplus and starting a war we couldn't afford and weren't prepared for? Were you upset when you found out that there were no WMD? Did you all like Cheney and Rumsfield? Maybe you should just sit down and shut up while someone tries to clean up some of the mess you people created!”
jmsent on Aug 17, 2009 at 21:50:51
“Even so, the chance of the republicans regaining the majority in either house is slim to none. Too bad for you.”
DaveCarroll4 on Aug 17, 2009 at 19:30:13
“Too bad there are no longer enough registered Republicans to win anything, anymore. The young and the minorities are not conservatives. It's over before it starts! The deficit started on the Bush watch, to fund WAR! This is about American lives being lost right here at home. Lack of Regulation crashed the economy and Republicans never want Regulation, so they have no legs to stand on!”
Aug 17, 2009 at 18:43:38
“Very good post my man, you bring up a very fine point that Americans are fully ignorant of the deplorable status of our own health, especially compared to Europe.
This entire debate about an exchange to buy private insurance or not entirely misses the point that the main driver of high cost health care in America is the status of our health.
We lead the world in consumption of anti depressants, according to the LA Times half of those anti depressants are prescribed wrongfully to people who dont need them, while half of the truly clinically depressed seek no health care at all and go about their depressed lives lowering productivity, depressing others, and refusing to seek help.
Until we get a real effective strategy to educate people about wellness, we will see an ever increasing bill for our poor choices in life.”
“What we are seeing is a repeat of 1992 when Clinton was elected. Remember Clinton raised taxes, proposed some energy taxes, did the gays in the military bill, all of which rallied the conservatives to maximum effect.
The latest gallup poll now proves that conservatives outnumber liberals in EVERY state in the union now. These conservatives have never like Obama and are now scared to death that big govt is on the rise. They dont really care what the details are, they just dont like big govt, unless its the military.
Watch what happens in next years elections. We will see massive turnout from the right, and lame turnout from the left since they will get a very weak health care reform bill, no global warming bill, and no new taxes on the rich. Liberals will be pissed at their man. Conservatives will be pissed at the ATTEMPTS at a move to the left by Obama.
END RESULT- Republicans take back the house in 2010, Obama moves to the center and focuses on the middle east and world affairs.
Obama care will reduce the uninsured problem and end the cancellation of policys problem, but cost reduction is a dream.
IF YOU THINK HEALT CARE IS EXPENSIVE NOW, YOU AINT SEEN NOTIN BABY”
jmsent on Aug 17, 2009 at 22:06:31
“Care to cite that gallup pole? As for big government, we saw what happened when Bush tried to privatize social security. And nobody except Dick Armey is for one second suggesting that Medicare be ended. You're making chit up.”
“PLEEZE Mike, give up on the public option my man, aint gonna happen, its kaput, gone.
Know why? Because the big insurers and big drug companys have millions to spend on tv ads that will certainly killy anything THEY want to kill. And they indeed will kill anything that even resembles competition to their gig. If these big companys blast the airwaves its over,,,,period.
And Obama and Conrad know it. Thats why they convened meetings to talk to them. To see what their demands were. Now they know that the public option is not acceptable to big business.
What exactly do you think would happen if the public option did indeed pass? Do you really believe the govt, the congress would manage efficiently this new program? Did you know that Medicare has at least a 10 % fraud rate? That is proven by New York Times reporters. Here in LA we read about the fraud that is caught, not what is happening.”
Roses on Aug 18, 2009 at 16:05:26
“Watch this. It may......just MAY.......change your mind.
There are a whole lot of things going on below the surface.
10% fraud? Okay, so, that leaves a 90% legitimacy rate. Yeah, see, that's pretty good ...”
sabredance on Aug 17, 2009 at 22:06:44
“Medicare has a 10% fraud rate? But it still has only a 3% overhead (vs. private insurance which has 20-25% overhead). That means with a little enforcement, it'll be even a bigger bargain! Thanks for the good news.”
reasonshouldrule on Aug 17, 2009 at 21:54:22
flyribbon on Aug 17, 2009 at 20:08:59
“The insurance companies take 30%. That's 3 times 10%.”
who38 on Aug 17, 2009 at 18:53:10
“A 10% fraud rate is nothing to the fraud perptuated on the public by Big PhRMA and the insurance industry.”
CabaretArtist on Aug 17, 2009 at 18:52:18
“More CraZy Talk dddave. The drug companies ARE RUNNING ADVERTISING FOR HC reform.”
MegWe on Aug 17, 2009 at 18:27:59
“uh..the drug companies are going to run ads FOR health reform.”
“Barack Obama, right man, wrong time.........plain and simple
The MAIN reason Obama got elected is because Bush was so BAD. PERIOD.....Thats not to say the Obama is not a very smart politician.
Remember,"right man, wrong time" that is to say that Obama is an old school liberal in a time when Bush has proven that indeed big govt generally messes things up, our taxes are high enough, and that Americans are not ready for more giant programs.
This is the main reason that Obama care is in trouble, not because of the old media, not because of Rush, but because Americans have little faith that even the great Obama can deliver an effective new health care program, and we cant really afford it.
No matter how great it sounds, even the merits of the arguments, will not over come what Bush has done to the credibility of the federal govt and congress. After all, they didnt even bother to check the facts before rushing us into a trillion dollar war in Iraq, and cant even manage to evacuate an American city with 3 days notice of an oncoming hurricane, and INFLATED the sub prime bubble by having fannie and freddy buy MORE loans in 04 when alarms were sounded and congressional hearings held. Democrats wanted to help their constituents become homeowners and Republicans wanted fannie to make money. Greenspan kept interest rates low because he believed the markets would self regulate ANY sort of bubble,”
“Heya Bob, great post, just wanted to add that Obama care will only TINKER with this flawed, fragmented, unfair and wasteful so called heatlhcare system. Why tinker with it?
The reason is because nobody has figured out how to transform this abomination without stepping on some very rich toes........UNTIL NOW
I have this big idea I call the TWO BILL SOLUTION, and it says that congress would write two bills, one written by the Democrats called the SPA program (single payer authority) and the second bill written by the Republicans called the TAC program (total choice-private insurance based)......THEN let the states OPT into either program voluntarily through a local election.
In this way we may see Oregon or Vermont opt into the SPA program and would elect its own board to run it, and would self tax and self rule. Likewise for Utah or Alabama with the TAC program.
In this way we mandate NOTHING on anybody and each program takes health care to the local level where it belongs. The Federal govt. has a very limited role in health care ( reasearch, the VA, and over seeing these new SPA and TAC programs) otherwise health care should be ran locally.
In this was we could see a results oriented attempt to reverse the obesity trends, slow down smoking, and have ONE authority that would be held accountable for its results. What say you?”
maab76 on Aug 17, 2009 at 13:11:19
“Like the idea of local oversite but have concern for the states with many needy folks. Would you compromise on the idea of regional as the organizing geographic? My priority was in the determining of how an insured group would be organized. It could be as small as a block or as large as a region with all of the staged steps in between. How say you?”
“Mr. Reich, the public option is DEAD, nadda, gone, aint gonna happen, EVER.
Know why? Because as much as I want to believe our great republic is all about freedom &democracy, it really is more about MONEY. And guess who has all the money in this debate? The drug companys and private insurers.
The private insurers and drug companys know that the public option is the END of their gig. They know that the public option is only the beginning of slowing down their gravy train, and they will stop at NOTHING to stop the public option. They will spend hundreds of millions of dollars to scare the bejesus out of the American people, all to end the public option.
Obama, the congress knows this, and will never put the public option to a vote, EVER.
Forget about the public option BOB, and instead tell Obama that he needs to reduce costs by educating the American people on diet and exercise. By investing in health advocates to baby along the family that wants to reduce obesity. To help the little ol lady who just had a stroke and now needs to drop the salt, exercise more or else she will have another stroke costing $50,000. Obama care is sadly too heavy on reducing the uninsured, and too light on reducing costs.
The more the American people see the facts, the more they are scared that this dysfunctional congress will get more authority and power over our health care. Please BOB”
“Obama has laid out his health care plan from day one of his campaign. I remember reading it back in the summer of 07. As I recall, Edwards came out with his plan, then Hillary had a half plan, then Obama had his plan which was almost the same as Edwards and Hillarys.
My point is that Obama has had the same positions ie. subsidys for the uninsured, universal acceptance of policy applicants, the evidence based scheme to reduce over use of medical treatments, the exchange to buy private insurance, and he has only talked about the public option.
What we have not seen from Obama is any real campaigning, or educating the American people about health care reform. Lets admit most Americans are ignorant about this complex issue.
The right has been consistently against any big govt. solutions to health care. No new taxes to fund any new scheme, and simply want to have more choice and more competition in the market place.
Ironically, Obama's exchange does just that, but the right has lied about it being a govt. take over, which it is not.
Obama care will only transfer payments in the existing system. It will only TINKER with the flawed, inefficient, and unfair system we have now. In the next decade we will revisit this sorry debate again, only then costs will be even higher.”
juggernaut1729 on Aug 5, 2009 at 04:32:42
“Obviously, it is a Government take over ... not of the healthcare industry but of the health insurance industry.
Now, one might protest and say that Obama's plan allows us to keep our private insurance coverage if we are happy with it. So, it does not really do away with choice.
While that is factually correct, that is not how it will work in practise.
The healthcare bill also has provisions for additional regulation of the health insurance industry.
It will now be illegal for insurance companies to turn away people with a pre-existing conditions. It will also be mandatory to provide coverage for non-standard procedures (such as a sex-reassignment surgery).
This will inevitably cause premiums for healthy people who do not want coverage for non-standard procedures (who I assume are a large majority of Americans) to shoot up.
The Government offered insurance plan on the other hand will offer coverage at lower premiums not because its costs are lower but because it does not have to worry about long term solvency. 30 years from now if the Government insurance provider goes bankrupt, the Government will promptly bail it out.
The consumers however will only see the lower present premiums and the guarantees that come with Government insurance and switch to it causing the private health insurance industry to be wiped out. So, there goes your choice.”
JKoos on Aug 4, 2009 at 23:54:50
“Obama should have pushed Euro style health care with all its warts. It is the only way to contain costs. All of the current plans deserve to die and will kill the carriers. Too many lawyers and too many fat catters.”
“I knew the public option was dead as soon as I heard it was proposed, WHY? because the private insurers and drug companys have loads of money to spend on flooding the airwaves with ads. WE the people DONT.
The politicians know this and will not pick a fight with the insurers and drug companys.
Even the great Obama knew this was a fantasy. The public option was not in his original policy statement way back in his campaign.
Understand folks what is about to happen. Obama care is simply having the Federal govt. subsize private insurance. THATS IT!!!!
Dont buy that costs will go down with this new Obama commission. This is unproven, and worse will be ran by our infinitely wise and efficient CONGRESS.
Spending will go up in Obama's white house and we will return to this sorry debate again as costs escalate with Obama care.”
nellie on Jul 27, 2009 at 20:03:31
“Public option -- still in the house bill, still in the senate health committee bill.”
“You miss one glaring difference between the Obama commission and the private insurers,,,,accountability.
Obama care like most govt. services has little accountability. The private insurers get sued for even one death, as they should.
Obama care will be just like Medicare, where the NY Times ran a fine investigative report that concluded that at least ten percent of all claims in NY, WERE FRAUDULENT.
Then the real drama began as Gov. Pataki pointed fingers at the Democratic legislature, the Bush HHS pointed fingers at the NY health dept., the NY legislature blamed the Governor, the state health dept. blamed the state attorney general Spitzer, and on and on. WHO GOT BLAMED FOR THIS WASTE OF BILLIONS?
These are the same folks who voted to allow Fanni and Freddi to INCREASE their purchase of sub prime loans, helping to inflate the bubble.
These are the same folks who cannot manage to evacuate an American city for a hurricane (Katrina).
These are the same folks who lied us into a war in Iraq, and now vote for hundreds of billions more each and every year....FOR WHAT?”
nosey10 on Jul 28, 2009 at 07:30:03
“Yes, they are ,democratic governor of Louisiana who wouldn't let the troops in-yes, state rights-same mayor who let 250 buses flood when he could have used them to get his people out. Barney Franks-Pelosi's "mystro" with the $787 Billion dollar stimilus that isn't working-he's the head of the committee who laughed at the regulators, Treasury Secretary Snow, and even Alan Greespan when they testified in front of his housing committee starting in 2002, . and then they sold these crap loans to investors all over the world and the whole housing market collapsed-We the taxpayers garentee Freddie Mac, even though they are a PRIVATE company. Then Raines, the CEO of Freddie Mac leaves with $50 million dollars and is now an advisor to Obama...All this time Barney Franks told the press all was okay and even harrassed the regulators ..And you still want a "unbiased" committee deciding what kind of health care treatments you get??. At least you can get good care and children are now covered under the new SCHIP;s program. This bill is a farce, medicare-I'm on it-requires a supplemental. If you can't afford your medicine, the drug companies,will lower your cost or give them to you-Walmart's already offering $4.00 prescriptions..so do a little research, it's all on U-tube and the NY Times articles and find out the real truth... 25 new agencies or more in this bill-giantic step for growing government-small step for us....”
Donnie4488 on Jul 27, 2009 at 19:45:17
“These were the same folks who were voted out of office last November.”
Donnie4488 on Jul 27, 2009 at 19:40:58
“Medicare,the VA, the DMV and a host of other gov run agencies have their faults, but they do run well and the public would scream if you took them away. Most of the fraud in Medicare stems from crooked doctors charging twice as much for a procedure or pill and passing the overage onto Medicare.”
The public option is dead, aint gonna happen. WHY? Because the Federal govt. is ran by and for money, and the private insurers and drug companys have loads of money. WE DONT.
The politicians know this and will not vote in a public option which will change the gig for the for profiteers. The public option would force price reductions, and negotiate prices for drugs, reducing their sales and profits.
Guess how much money the private insurers and drug companys have to spend on defeating the public option..............hundreds of millions......to flood the airwaves to defeat the public option. To scare jim and jill sixpack, to defeat Obama care entirely.
So the politicians choose not to pick this fight, and will simply declare victory on reducing the number of uninsured.
The battle on cost reduction will be lost. In fact Obama care will only RAISE spending on health care as millions of formerly uninsured will now see a doctor. And guess what, they will need cholesterol lowering drugs, be prediabetic, hypertensive, needing more care and more drugs.
Obama care will FAIL miserably in reining in cost for health care and we will be back at this debate in the next decade when costs will be even higher.”
“We are currently paying DOUBLE per capita what Europe spends for health care, and get below average outcomes for our money. THOSE ARE THE FACTS.
Japanese LOVE going to the Doctor, and do it at four times the rates Americans do. The French are allowed to see ANY doctor, at ANY time, at ANY place, The Germans have no waiting list problems like the British or Canadians do. And have universal coverage, and have healthier populations.
This debate is really only about one thing, COST, and now that the American people are paying attention, they realize Obama care is more about insuring the uninsured, and less about COST reduction.
This is scaring the American people who know first hand the expense of health care, but are not in the mood to raise taxes to fund some scheme that may or may not work to insure these folks. Americans would be for some plan to reduce costs.
This new Obama care commission to determine what is and what is not appropriate care is truly SCARY! This new commission will be ran by the same folks who gave us Katrina, the phony Iraq war, the sub prime mortgage debacle, the looming medicare bankruptcy, and on and on.
Now they want to begin to rein in costs by claiming this treatment is APPROPRIATE. Baloney.
Obama care is sadly a very small step in the right direction. We will certainly be debating theses issues again in the future as spending only goes up.”
Heartlight3 on Jul 28, 2009 at 00:38:59
“Does anyone ever consider that we could afford to pay more taxes for health care if we were not spending $13,000 a year on health insurance premiums for our family?”
Donnie4488 on Jul 27, 2009 at 18:59:43
“The Obama care commission is no different than what the insurance companies are doing now. That's what drives doctors crazy, countermanding their medical orders and deciding what the treatment or medicine should be.”
“You may as well stop moaning about this fantasy called the public option. AINT GONNA HAPPEN.
WHY? Because Washington DC is ran with MONEY, and the private insurers, and the drug companys have loads of money. The 71% of us folks who support the public option currently have little money. And we certainly are not going to spend our money to support the public option.
Guess how much money the private insurers and drug companys have to defeat the public option. how about hundreds of millions. To bombard the airwaves with ads scaring the bejesus out of joan and jim sixpack.
And the politicians know it.
The private insurers and drug companys know that the public option will END their current gig. It will negotiate price reductions with the drug companys, and will force price reductions on premiums. So they will fight the public option with all they have.
As for the centrist label, they are simply a little more frugal with our tax money than Obama and the liberals. Why bag on them?”
nylibgrrl on Jul 28, 2009 at 00:11:15
“"As for the centrist label, they are simply a little more frugal with our tax money than Obama and the liberals. Why bag on them?"
Are they? Seems to me that, on this issue certainly, it's a convenient excuse so that people who don't bother to think and find out the truth won't see that the BD's are lining their pockets with some of that "all the drug co's have" to fight the public option with. If people have any sense, and I think most of them do, they'll be able to see through what the insurance co's are doing--just like you and I have.”
socal56 on Jul 27, 2009 at 20:13:51
“how right you are. we can apply this corruption of our gov't with the endless flow of lobbyists money for any issue. President Obama unfortunatley is either unwilling or unable to be the game changer we need. This is an issue greater than just health care. It is class warfare! Name an issue where the 1%er's are not involved in right now.”
Romeover on Jul 27, 2009 at 19:24:07
“If ten million Americans gave $100 each to the campaign for health care reform, it would amount to $1B. Just think of the return on investment for each of those citizens.
“Obama may be the right man, but at the wrong time. He is a natural leader, a heroic American, and a gifted orator. But he has met his match when it comes to timing in American history.
He is a liberal seeking massive spending on subsidized health insurance, higher prices for energy to stem global warming, and will not dare to reign in defense spending.
The problem is we are broke. Deficits of 1.8 trillion, IN A YEAR!
Right man, wrong time.
As for the above article, I read that for the past 30 years our wages have not gone up even one penny, yet our consumption has doubled. HOW? Because the stock markets have doubled, and more. Because housing prices have doubled, and more. Because our savings have gone down, allowing us to spend more. Because women have entered the workforce in greater numbers increasing family incomes.
Now we have borrowed ourselves into a decade of poor growth and stagnant wages.
Blame both the Democrats for the subprime mess as they WANTED more subprime loans to aid their working poor consitituents. Blame the Republicans who wanted Fannie and Freddie to profit and prosper.”
“Obama is looking more and more like the right man for the job, but at the wrong time. He is a liberal who wants to spend his way through problems, but we are BROKE!
Obama care is too heavy on spending, too light on cost reduction.
WHY? because the two main drivers of high cost are 1. the wasteful, fragmented system itself. and 2. the poor health of the American people.
How does Obama care fix these two drivers of high cost. HE DOESNT,
Instead he simply tinkers with this flawed system. He adds more rules, more spending from the feds, more layers upon the already mind boggling layers of insurers, billing agencys, middlemen, who already clog up what is supposed to be a simple transaction.
I get sore throat, I see Doctor, I pay
Instead it goes like this,,,,,,,,,,I pay medicare tax, I pay 20% for my share of private policy , property taxes to pay for county health care , state income taxes to pay for state system, income taxes to pay for fed programs, employer pays for workers comp policy for my health care ON THE JOB, and I pay for auto insurance which covers me in my CAR.
ARE WE INSANE?
And we all know the sorry state of our health in this nation. World class obesity, smoking, drinking, drug abuse, laziness, and then we ask,"why is health care so expensive" LOOK IN THE MIRROR”
jakiew on Jul 20, 2009 at 20:22:26
“in other countries their people dont' have to give the ins. and hospitals half their paychecks. we've been ripped off and lied to for so long, people actually believe the lies the repub.s and health industry spew out . i say , NO MORE LIES! ! !”
jakiew on Jul 20, 2009 at 20:17:14
“other countries don't have to pay an arm and a leg for healthcare. they get to spend their money on other things. why should the insurance companies get all our money. THAT'S INSANE.”
One blogger said that Obama care doesnt go far enough, but that it was better than nothing.
Consider that Obama care is nothing more than a giant money shuffle. Currently hospitals pay for the uninsured, they take a loss on those services. And the state and county govts. take a loss by paying for health care for the uninsured, it is paid for with our taxes.
The Obama care shuffle will only increase the payments by the federal govt. by subsidizing private health insurance through the Obama care exchange, and will lower the amount paid by state and local govts. because more people will be insured through Obama care. This is nothing more than a grand shuffle.
Private insurers and the hospitals are over joyed at the prospect of signing up millions of uninsured, thanks to the increased subsidys by Obama care.
The question is simply, WILL THE STATES lower taxes since they will stop paying for free health care for the lower number of uninsured?
What will the states and countys do with this windfall in revenue?
Can the federal govt. afford these new costs to cover the uninsured through Obama care?
:ARE YOU STILL SURE THAT THIS IS BETTER THAN NOTHING?”
KQuark on Jul 17, 2009 at 15:15:24
“Wrong again a public plan will kick in under both plans.”
“Dear Senator, you are delusional if you really believe that 97% figure.
Consider that a third of the uninsured TODAY currently make over $50,000 a year and CAN afford private insurance but CHOOSE not to buy it. What on gods green earth are you going to do to get them to buy private insurance? Subsidys? An exchange?
Also consider that a third of the current uninsured QUALIFY for EXISTING govt. health care programs but fail to sign up. Do they not know of these programs? Are they just derelicts? Are they ignorant? Again what on gods green earth will make them sign up for Obama care? And how will they afford the co pays, and deductibles if they are poor?
Lastly consider that millions of Americans are illegals, are living in the black market with no paychecks, no taxes paid, are on the run from skipping out on child support, or fines etc. What will make them sign up for Obama care?
This is the reason I say the Obama care will at best deliver half of the uninsured into the ranks of the insured which will leave us with 22 million uninsured, and one HELL OF A BILL for this band aid of a bill we call Obama care.
Single payer is the only option as it signs up everybody. I wish we could have a smaller, limited, focused single payer authority elected locally, with accountability. THAT WOULD BE GREAT”
socalgal38 on Jul 16, 2009 at 01:44:42
“I totally agree with single payer, not so sure i would have used those facts the way you did. OH btw the bill that is being proposed will not allow for illegals to qualify for any plan. Not sure what we will do with them if they get sick since they are cutting the state funding for emergancy rooms.”
smarti on Jul 15, 2009 at 22:13:49
“As someone who makes JUST $50,000/year with a husband who has been recently laid off due to the recession, I can tell you that if my employer did not provide health insurance I could NOT afford it as an individual for a family of 3. Insurance coverage for my family would equal our monthly rent payment, and no, cutting cell phone and cable service would not begin to cover the costs. You obviously have never shopped for private insurance in the individual market. The premiums are huge, the out of pocket costs even worse, and the conditions for coverage are laughable if it wasn't dealing with your life. And, of course, this is assuming private insurance will cover us seeing as how I was hospitalized when I was 4 years old for corrective vision surgery;. I'm sure that would cancel some future some claim according to their BS rules.”
jmpurser on Jul 15, 2009 at 20:14:02
“They are going to get the people who can afford health insurance but don't by sending the IRS after them. Cause, when you think health care solutions you think IRS right?
Seriously, that's the plan. You'll have to report your health care policies on your tax return.”
“Mr Creamer says that Dems should support Obama care if they want to be re-elected in 2010, but consider that even if Obama care passes, and for sure it will NOT have the public option, what will the Dems have to run on?
An economy that might have turned the corner, certainly not producing the millions of jobs needed just to get back to 08 levels. Economists are not even sure when the job growth will pick up. If it doesn't by next summer, Dems are in trouble.
As for health care reform, the Dems will brag about the reduction of uninsured as many will take advantage of generous subsidys to purchase private insurance through the Obama care exchange.
The price for these subsidys will be much higher than Dems are telling us now. All estimates of costs for federal programs are ALWAYS underestimated.
The bill out of the house currently gives a subsidy to any family making under $88,000 per year. This means that if your employer is having problems, it can simply allow you to buy the health insurance form the exchange with a federal subsidy, which allows the employer to reduce its health insurance costs.
END result the will be over $100bn price tag, and the American people will pull the plug on Democrats in power as the jobs fail to materialize and the debt just keeps on pilin up.
Remember, "tax and spend liberals" its. BAAAAACK, Republicans take the house back in 2010”
bighat on Jul 15, 2009 at 20:33:09
“my bet is they will run on a 3rd stimulus package. Must help more of those companies too big to fail. NBC comes to mind”
cheforacle on Jul 15, 2009 at 19:45:05
“Your comment is based entirely on the assumption that the bill that eventually passes will not have a public option. On what basis can you claim that? Nobody knows how this will play out yet. No one. Not the President, the Speaker, the head of HHS or any insurance company exec or committee chair. Its too early and there is still a ton of negotiating to do.”
“Heya Jason, great work again, just wanted to say that there are lies coming from both sides of this so called debate.
You claim that Obama care will NOT be funded from cutting Medicare and Medicaid. Did you consider that an optimistic percentage of the uninsured that will sign up for Obama care might be half.
Therefore, AFTER Obama care passes, we will still have over 20 million uninsured that will still rely on Medicaid and Medicare. In fact Medicare will save NOTHING from insuring the unisured. In fact Medicare is slated to go broke in 8 years according to the trustees of the program.
How exactly will Obama care save Medicare?
Obama care is heavy on higher spending and modest on cost reductions. No expert can reliably predict ANY savings from the so called public option, or the best practices policy.
THe main problem in American health care is COST, and the two main drivers of high cost are 1. the inefficient, wasteful, and unfair system itself, 2. the poor status of our health. We are obese, smoke, live with too much stress and anxiety, have poor sex lives, and take too many drugs.
How exactly does Obama care address any of these two main drivers of high cost. The promises made by Obama are fiction, and we will revisit this sorry debate in 10 years when costs will be even higher, and the bill comes due from this massive eating binge we have enjoyed for the last decade.”
cinesimon on Jul 13, 2009 at 19:02:26
“Are you SERIOUSLY saying the new administration is doing nothing with regards to preventative health care?
And with regards to the "No expert can reliably predict ANY savings from the so called public option" line: that's either ignorant or just a lie. You do realize that every other western nation has public health care - some single payer, some a pubic/private combination - and while they all continue to strive for improvement, they'd never, ever go the way of America: simply put, America has the only government in the world that believes profit is more important than the well being of it's citizens.
The benefits to universal health care are so incredibly obvious and so massive, that the only way to rigorously oppose it is to lie and name call, and deny the reality that America is alone with this current system, and nobody wishes to join her.
The current model overall is a net deficit.
Those truly interested in gross national improvement would be lobbying for this reform - which is why the only people opposing this are the insurance companies(and those gullible enough to believe the Luntz talking points) - because they know the ghoulish fraud that's costs millions of families their homes and health, their marriages and their children, is nearing it's end.
That is why they're spending $1.4m per day on lobbyists: nothing to do with healthcare: it's about profit. And the past year has confirmed the argument that profit is incentive for excellence is well”
hp blogger Jason Rosenbaum on Jul 13, 2009 at 17:28:01
“What makes you think Obama's plan won't cost less or be higher quality? From what I've seen, he addresses both payment reform and preventative medicine.”
“Heya Alec, this is Dave Wood, how are you today? I have no comment about the theater but would like your help in spreading the word about my big idea called the TWO BILL SOLUTION (health care reform).
The TWO BILL SOLUTION says that Congress would write TWO bills, 1. written by the liberals called the SPA program (single payer authority) and 2nd bill written by the conservatives called the TAC program (private insurance based- total choice and competition)
THEN let the states opt into either program voluntarily through a local election.
In this way we may see liberal Vermont opt into the SPA program and would elect its own board to run it. Vermonters would self rule and self tax. Likew ise for conservative Kansas where it may opt into the TAC program and would elect its own board to self rule and self tax.
This is the ONLY way to get to single payer, by giving the right exactly what it wants in the deal. What say you......”
karma13612 on Jul 19, 2009 at 15:08:56
“Wow, that's a scary thought.
What happens if you live in a state that 'elects' TAC and you are a proponent of SPA. How is that fair? And don't tell me to move. I can't just pick up roots, give up a job, not sell my house in this lousy market, and move to a state having SPA which I am for.”
“This whole exercise in this so called health care debate is a total waste of time because the entire structure, the whole system in American health care is flawed, wasteful, inefficient and unfair. So why tinker with the flawed monster?
Obama care will only TINKER with this mess. All the problems are well known and well studied.
The problem is how to fix them. The conservatives are adamant that private insurance based more choice and more competition will cut costs and improve quality, AND THEY MIGHT BE RIGHT.
The liberals say that a government ran single payer system will lower costs and improve quality and efficiency. THEY MIGHT BE RIGHT.
Obama care gives us the WORST of both worlds, that is to say we get gigantic inefficient and poorly managed programs (Medicaid has been documented to pay out at least 10% of its budget on fraudulent claims) and we get private insurance companys that have such a dominant position in the market place that they really dictate prices instead of competing on price.
I have no faith that Obama care and the congress will EVER lower spending and run a tight ship regarding these new programs Obama care will bring us.
If you think health care is expensive now, YOU AINT SEEN NOTHIN BABY>”
“The sad truth is the American people are totally ignorant of the mess that American health care is in.
My wife is a RN and I know a great deal about this issue. If we are to rely on politicians who only rely on polls, we are in trouble. Health care reform is too complex for polling.
And what is the big deal about this public option? Does anybody believe that the public option, which will be ran by the same congress that runs the bankrupt Medicare program, will actually be an efficient and well ran program? Did you know that the NY TImes has proven that at least 10% of all its claims are FRAUDELENT.
The public option will only DEEPEN our problems. I have no faith that the Congress will stop being inept managers. Imagine what it takes just to raise the fee for an office visit for your local doctor. Congressional hearings, lobbyist visits, votes, polls, and then the Republicans take back power and the whole game changes, more hearings, more votes, more polls, JUST TO RAISE THE PAYMENT FOR AN OFFICE VISIT.”