I get what you're saying, and I agree that demographic marketing is powerful. I get that women spend lots of money on makeup and clothes. I just think it's more complicated than you're allowing for.
First, appearance is something women HAVE to care about, at least a little, if they want to be taken seriously in most areas of public life. We could debate for days about gender roles in America and the world, but I think that is a relatively uncontroversial statement. So of course some women are going to take it to an extreme, and that's where stereotypes are born. These particular women are sort of forced into that extreme, as being famous is inevitably focused upon looks. Saying that all women spend so much money on this and that STILL fails to account for the variety of experience within women as a group. Talking about demographics in advertising and marketing does not exhaust what can be said of human experience, men or women.
The second thing that I think is important is considering how men's trivial hobbies don't get turned into their entire personalities in the media...that's more where I was going with the list of "stereotypically male interests." Men in the public eye are allowed to have some trivial interests and still not be labelled as trivial altogether.”
vensid on Mar 9, 2014 at 03:01:02
“The red carpet is not an intellectual forum, it is a commercial for movies and couture. The women are receiving some kind of compensation for wearing the dress, including the privilege of wearing of the dress, so they are asked about it. That's the deal, one that the men don't get.
It is condescending to paint the average woman's interest in couture as a "trivial hobby" they are "forced" into. Outside of gender studies courses, you will find most women enthusiastic volunteers who are far more harsh with what another woman wears than men are.
Your use of the word "all" is a stock strawman. When I say "women" I don't mean "all" anymore than when you say "men" you mean "all." So let's drop the lecture of the diversity of women's experiences. If the male demo suddenly gave up sports, the industry would collapse because there are not enough female fans to support it. Same thing with couture.
You say women are judged by appearance. All people are. Men are judged on a scale from loser to stud by what they wear, but also net worth and manliness. Markets know this and tailor their appeals accordingly and we, like women, are our own worst enemies. We are just not allowed to complain or blame others like women are.”
“Yeah, they only read articles about baseball and NASCAR and ties and suits and tools beer.
...or women aren't a unitary entity, all alike in every single way...just like men.”
vensid on Mar 7, 2014 at 22:13:55
“So many responders restructure the argument to a similar false dichotomy like yours, either all women are X or no women are X. That not how reality works. That was never the argument. Exceptions prove the rule. When companies stop making billions off of female audiences like this, the questions will stop being asked of women about their clothes and hair and diets. People like you don't work in marketing or advertising because you would try to sell to theoretical demographics and individuals and consistently fail to increase sales. You don't care about that stuff. That's nice. Millions of women test marketed every year are not like you and shell out their money to the tune of BILLIONS. Why is it so hard for women to own their own s__t?”
“As much as I am all for people eating less additives in their food, and for pushing regulatory agencies to disallow so many kinds of additives, an ingredient being separately used in something edible and in something non-edible does not mean the ingredient itself is not edible.”
I know that the chemistry between Brody and Carrie is a central element to this story; they have a kind of obsessive lightning that is very interesting to watch.
But to say that the whole thing centers upon that love story...just sounds lame. I guess it sounds reductionist. There's all this stuff mixed up: power and loyalty and patriotism and god complexes and emotion and fear and love and hate and torture and family and on and on and on.
"Just a love story" sounds so banal, like a retread of everything we've ever seen in the movies and on TV.”