“This is not a political issue. Neither party does much of anything - except the women of each party.
This is an accountability issue in the media to start!”
Laserbeam on Nov 2, 2011 at 15:44:05
“I disagree, as both a survivor of dv and someone who worked for a dv non-profit for years. I have seen the Republicans do far more damage to women than Democrats. Mind you, that is definitely not to say that I think the Democrats are perfect, great, or even adequate - I don't when it comes to dv or reproductive rights.
It was the Bush administration who cut funding for all dv agencies unless they agreed to divulge the social security numbers of ALL WOMEN in confidential shelters or lose their federal funding. The agency I worked for chose to lose their funding - a substantial hit, I might add. I certainly wouldn't mind if the Obama administration were pressured to remove that restriction. This database with women's ssn's is a PUBLIC database - any perp with some know-how could track someone.”
“I encourage you all to contact:
1. NJ Attorney General Paula Dow and David Pine's boss Camelia Valdes - neither returned our calls yesterday regarding the online petition linked here which has 959 signatures. Only NJ Gov Christie's office made themselves available.
2. Gannett, owner of The Journal News
Gannett Co., Inc.
7950 Jones Branch Drive
McLean, VA 22107-0150
1) I wrote that many rapes at colleges are gang rapes.
2) Let me be perfectly clear - THE BLAME LIES SOLELY WITH ONE PARTY - THE ATTACKER! Not the victim!”
DrSnuggles on Apr 11, 2011 at 10:34:09
“1) You never wrote that in your article, that is something you have disseminated later in the comment section to try to explain away your appalling use of statistics. The vast majority of sexual assaults on college campuses are not violent but 'lack of consent' such as statutory rape and 'date' rape. These are still terrible offenses but are not gang rape.
2) I absolutely agree and wish you wouldn't demean this message by actively defending a ridiculous misstatement that you said.”
“Further, here are stats of for teenage girls (which are even worse, showing a disturbing trend) on dating violence:
"Nearly 1 in 3 teens
who have been in relationships have experienced the most serious forms of dating violence and abuse including sexual abuse, physical abuse, or threats of physical harm to a partner or self." http://loveisnotabuse.com/web/guest/fast-facts
1 in 3!!!
And people here are truly surprised that 1 in 5 college men could be guilty of sexual assault or rape?
Simply goes to show we need education and awareness!”
hp blogger Dr. Jonathan David Farley on Apr 10, 2011 at 17:21:17
“Yes, 1 in 3, with the definition of "sexual abuse" being not Cardinal Law-type abuse, but "pressur[ing] you to perform oral sex" or "pressur[ing] you into having sex".
“Good lord. Did you really just assume that 1 in 5 women being assaulted means 1 in 5 men commit assaults? I've been looking all over since I read your article assuming that you had a statistic that you just hadn't cited appropriately.
Look, the closest I found is this study: http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/springer/vav/1999/00000014/00000003/art00002 from 1999 which suggests in the abstract that up to 25% of men in their sample admitted to "sexual coercion." Unfortunately, I can't access the actual article to quote the specific data and see if the sample they are referring to is representative of all men--nor can I tell what "sexual coercion" in this case refers to, and whether it is comparable to "sexual assault or rape" as you say. I expect you can, however, and would hope you might use the data I've given you to provide us all with an answer.
More importantly, if finding a solution to this issue is really important to you, we can't play fast and loose with the facts. If you're going to tell men that 20% of them are rapists, they are going to be shocked, and you need us to remain engaged in the issue if real progress is to be made. It won't happen, as I've discovered in my own small attempts to raise awareness of the problem, if men who have never engaged in such heinous activity feel demonized because of their gender alone.”
Json on Apr 7, 2011 at 15:01:03
“"And people here are truly surprised that 1 in 5 college men could be guilty of sexual assault or rape?"
Yes! You are backing up bad statistical analysis with more bad analysis. You are assuming that the dating in high school is evenly spread among men, which is almost certainly not the case. If you were involved with the math and chess clubs, chances are you had much fewer dates than a football or basketball player. It could be as much as an order of magnitude.
So if 20% of women in college have been assaulted, the percentage of men doing the assaults is likely to be significantly lower, possibly as low as 3-5%. A guy that assaults a women (and experiences no repercussions) is much more likely to do it again.
(Your conclusions may be 100% accurate, but the data you provide does not prove your assertions.)”
Libertarian09 on Apr 7, 2011 at 01:16:24
“I am not at all surprised.
People are abusive for the most part, out to get what they can for themselves and be damned to the consequences they may inflict on others. The form that abusiveness takes varies considerably but it is an issue shared equally among men and women.
To me it shows not that we need more education and awareness, but a fundamental change in society”
Rasputin66 on Apr 7, 2011 at 00:32:43
“Ms. Siskind, do you really have no response to my question? I've asked along with several others for a source on your "20% of college men are rapists" statistic. Is it that you don't feel like revealing your source, or do you just lack one completely?
Do you have any response to the two repeat-offender studies I posted, showing that the average college rapists perpetrates about 5 assaults each?”
“The occurrences of "repeat offenders" is offset my rampant "gang rapes". You'll need to cite some empirical evidence indicating there is anything more than a slight variance from 20%.”
seraphimblade on Apr 9, 2011 at 19:44:58
YOU need to cite some empirical evidence. If you're going to give a number, and expect it to have any credibility, you can't just make it up, nor derive it from something it doesn't logically derive from. Asking you what that source is is not unreasonable. If the answer is "I derived the 20% on this side from the 20% on that side", people have correctly pointed out that these don't logically correlate. It's well known that sex offenders are often repeat offenders.
That's not to say the problem isn't a serious one. But you do yourself and those you hope to help a disservice by doing fuzzy math, and then refusing to either retract or provide more accurate numbers. You can't just make up numbers to make something sound bad. It ruins the credibility you need to address a very real problem.”
h0tr0d on Apr 7, 2011 at 17:10:07
“Do you take the same position on mothers abusing children ? Should we call on all women to stop mothers abusing women ?”
Ed Baker on Apr 7, 2011 at 13:54:37
“Oh please - you demand statistical evidence in response to your own conjecture?”
Rasputin66 on Apr 7, 2011 at 01:24:21
“I think it would be helpful for your readers to be presented with any evidence whatsoever that the number gang rapists offsets the number of repeat offenders. Sociology is a science and sciences are based on actual facts, not guesses, ad hominem attacks, and inflammatory rhetoric. It's pretty disrespectful to your readers (and the Huff itself) to insult us by citing made-up facts and then insulting your critics. A respectable journalist would address concerns about her facts and would definitely, definitely cite her sources.”
“Are you refuting the Department of Justice? For real?
Just curious why you seek to diminish this issue? Guilty conscious?”
karter on Apr 6, 2011 at 16:02:51
“Wow, that's uncalled for. Just because he doesn't like your funny numbers..... Talk about false accusations...”
progressivestance84 on Apr 6, 2011 at 00:34:45
“Accusing this guy of rape because he disagrees with the facts of the study is slander, pure and simple.”
nickybecky1 on Apr 5, 2011 at 23:57:56
“I don't think most of the people on here are refuting the Department of Justice's data on the percentage of women who experience sexual assault and rape. I also think most of the commenters agree that it is a VERY serious issue. I think they're questioning the assumption that this is accompanied by the mirror statistic that 20% of the men must be doing the sexual assault - do you have somewhere that you read the statistic about men, or was it inferred from the statistic about survivors?
Rasputin66 already linked to this http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2010/03/25/predator-theory/, but it's a great summary of some of the research out there that has been done regarding the percentage of men who are out there committing these crimes. Frankly, I struggled with whether to enter this conversation at all because it does not appear to be a dialogue, but rather a series of attacks on anyone who has wanted to know more about this topic when the statistic doesn't align with a lot of what others have read.
Regardless of whether 20% or 4% of men are committing these crimes, it's a serious issue that affects 20% of women in a serious, life-altering and threatening ways. We should together focus on proactive solutions to move forward and change our world.”
“Cite data to refute please? Cite data in college of repeat offenders that would lowest this more than marginally? Then, give your background with statistical analysis and let's match up.”
Rasputin66 on Apr 14, 2011 at 13:56:04
“Well, I cited the data. I posted the link twice but here it is again:
What do you think about these two studies??? Don't you think it's kind of, I don't know, unethical to ignore actual facts? As I've said before, sociology is a science, based on facts and data. I think that as a "journalist" (or future journalist maybe?) you should address the fact that your piece has a glaring, major fallacy in paragraph 2.”
Giglawyer on Apr 6, 2011 at 23:25:13
“This is an excellent deflection. You can't back up your statistics, so you ask others to back theirs up, and then require a resume? Wow...just wow...”
Rasputin66 on Apr 6, 2011 at 05:24:42
“Thanks for responding, Ms. Siskind. I'm kind of confused by your response. I wasn't asking for a refutation of anything in particular, just a clarification. What's the source of this "20% of college men are rapists" figure? I've never seen it before and I would like to look at the paper myself or at least an article about it. I've heard various figures around 20-50% for numbers of college women who will be assaulted (although again I think the numbers must be much higher). Are you just extrapolating that each college-going woman is assaulted by a different man, and that man also happens to be in college? I think that assumption would be pretty misguided.
I'm not a statistical analyst. I'm just a female college student, rape survivor and feminist. Second generation on all counts, hi mom.
I read about two studies here: http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2010/03/25/predator-theory/
which illustrate the problem of predatory repeat offenders. One study finds that 6% of respondents admitted to rape, and that most of those men committed 5.8 rapes each. One thing you should keep in mind is that this is all SELF REPORTED by the rapists-- so the figures are probably higher. The other study is about army guys, not college kids.
I agree with Nicky that to fudge the stats seems to normalize abhorrent behavior. Also, it tends to undermine one's credibility. Finally, I think it's pretty hard on men as a whole.”
Shaun Hensley on Apr 6, 2011 at 03:30:08
“When you don't cite data to support your claim, there is nothing to refute.”
AceWild on Apr 6, 2011 at 02:25:57
“"Thanks to the Clery Act, all higher-ed institutions must publish and distribute an annual campus security report, complete with full crime statistics from the past three years. These documents are easily found online. You can check them yourself, and follow along with the numbers, here:"
“This is the first time at HuffPost I have commented on a story I wrote.
I am simply astounded to see men here explain away rape or sexual assault under the guise of hormones. I can only say shame on you, and presume you were perhaps on of the 20% yourself and are now trying to justify your own behavior?
As one commenter beautifully put, this is basic human rights - not to be sexually violated. Anyone who crosses that boundary belongs in jail. Period!”
DrSnuggles on Apr 7, 2011 at 11:11:21
“While I agree with the jist of your article (except for it's focus on men. Our young women need to be educated as well, if in nothing more than self-defense. To suggest otherwise is somewhat disempowering of women. While they are obviously never to blame; suggesting that it is completely in the man's control that they become victims or not is somewhat misogynistic). The statistic that 20% of all college women are sexually assaulted does not imply that 20% of all college men will sexually assault women.
This is a terrible misuse of statistics (and by terrible I mean grossly incorrect, not evil or some such) for two reasons; the first being it's simply incorrect the second being it goes against common sense. For this assumption to be true;
"Likelihood of a man being a repeat offender = Likelihood of a girl being a repeat victim"
If this were true, it's tantamount to saying that 'some girls are asking for it' which I KNOW is not your point of view. Nor is it mine.”
Giglawyer on Apr 6, 2011 at 23:16:37
“To the author:
I am floored at your flippant attitude. Statistics may show that 1 in 5 women will be sexually assaulted in college, this does not mean that 20% of college males are perpetrating these crimes. Other posters have proven your statistical analysis to be terribly flawed, and you respond with ad hominem attacks, accusing them of possibly being rapists with guilty consciences. Really?
Your basic message is sound, but you failed the statistical analysis. Own up to your failure, or you lose all credibility on an important message.”
boycottrightwingthings on Apr 6, 2011 at 10:18:03
“F and F # 65! Well said.”
rmarie on Apr 6, 2011 at 03:54:47
“I hear you, but it's not surprising to me...think about it, if our society didn't have such an attitude, we wouldn't have this problem with sexual assault. We tend to blame victims, and make excuses for the perpetrators.”
nickybecky1 on Apr 6, 2011 at 00:53:10
“I agree that it is a basic human right not to be sexually violated, but as a survivor myself, I want to point out that the assumption that 20% of women are assaulted by 20% of men may actually diminish the criminal nature of sexual assault and rape. If each man who rapes only ever rapes one woman, then it fits into a victim-blaming, boys-will-be-boys paradigm in which rape is less a crime and more a regret. Any type of rape or sexual assault is a crime, even if our society refuses to acknowledge it as such. Additionally, studies such as the one Rasputin66 shares http://www .feministe .us/blog/archives/2010/03/25/predator-theory/ describe the way college rapists do not fit into our image of a college guy who drank too much and made some bad decisions but tend to repeatedly prey on victims in a easily recognizably criminal way. However, our rape culture continues to be so pervasive that we refuse to believe these statistics. As long as these images persist, victim-blaming and a culture that is unfortunately accepting of rape will continue.”
jf12 on Apr 5, 2011 at 22:55:14
“Incarceration is the key. Educating repeat offenders, the ones doing the offending, doesn't help much.”
Alphaman1964 on Apr 5, 2011 at 22:12:12
“I agree! We need to incarcerate 20% of all the young men attending college in America!”
Chauncey1186 on Apr 5, 2011 at 21:26:48
“Wow - so anyone who disagrees with you who happens to be male is "one of the 20%"? Really?
Rasputin66 on Apr 5, 2011 at 20:39:45
“Several people are asking where you got the figure that 20% of college men are rapists. Will you answer us?”
“I believe this blogger is on the board of The New Agenda. Does Ms. Siskind think that Palin, Angle, Whitman, Fiorina, McMahon, Brewer, and on and on are going to do one thing to further women's agendas. Or are they going to continue to bow to their corporate masters, outsource jobs, further seperate the haves from the have nots? Will they do ANYTHING different than their male conservative Republican counterparts? I think not.”
“I stand corrected. I just Googled it and she is pro-choice. My friend was wrong and I should have known better. Thanks for pointing it out. It makes me feel better if she does win but I still cant support a corporatist who has a questionable past with her help. I wish we had a 'None of the Above' this time around here in California but we dont.”
cordyc on Oct 13, 2010 at 23:05:51
“Jerry is and was a Jesuit trained Catholic. Of course, he is personally pro life but he has always recognized that OB/Gyn decisions are between a woman and her doctor. That is what Pro-Choice is all about. It also means birth control education, information and supplies should be easily available to all.”