Chris Matthews and Pat Buchanan got into a long argument on Tuesday's "Hardball" about President Obama's academic credentials.
The clash was precipitated by (surprise, surprise) Donald Trump, who has said he doesn't think Obama was qualified to go to Harvard or Columbia, and was suspicious about how he was admitted to both schools. Buchanan said he supported Trump's curiosity.
"These are legitimate questions!" he exclaimed, wondering why Matthews was supporting what he called Obama's "right to conceal" his academic records. He guessed that Obama's rise through the Ivy League ranks was "affirmative action all the way."
"Why is it your guess?" Matthews asked. "...How do you make these assumptions? Do you know how this bothers people that you make these charges?"
"What I want to know is why you don't want to see the test scores?" Buchanan shot back. "Why don't you want to see any of these things? You're supposed to be a journalist! The people's right to know!"
"What am i supposed to become a master of his paperwork?" Matthews said. He told Buchanan that his arguments were one of the reasons that black Americans were often driven "crazy" by political discourse. Obama, he pointed out, had, by all accounts, had a stellar academic career, "and you still don't buy it. You don't buy him." He noted that "I got my job here without ever showing any paperwork from school."WATCH: